Why is Jump skill so useless?

[dcollins]

I'm just looking for the "spectacular jumping" abilities that I remember monks having in 3.0, that have been removed for everyone in 3.5.

I'm afraid you're remembering incorrectly. My group still only plays 3.0. In my PHB, monks have jump as a class skill, and no limitation based on their height (a nonissue in 3.5), and that's it.

 

[Corlon]

On one hand, it sucks that you couldn't use your jump to good effect, but on the other hand...20 archers each with 80 hp in some trees vs. a monk with no balance or climb and a vow of poverty seems like a dumb fight to just run into.
Generally jump can be made much better with a mix of climb and balance.
You said your balance was +0 (I think, sorry if I'm wrong), which would mean you have a 10 dexterity? Possibly investing more in dexterity or intelligence would have been a good idea.

But in general, for getting up places, jump isn't the greatest skill, and whether or not jump can be very useful is a DM sort of thing.

I really don't know what my original point in typing this was, but whatever I just said, there you have it.

 

[Tessarael]

Balance, Climb and Jump are very weak skills. They are easily surpassed by numerous low level spells: Jump (1st - gives up to +30 Jump at 9th level), Spiderclimb (1st), Alter Self (2nd - change to a humanoid form with wings), Levitate (2nd), and Fly (3rd). The only real advantage with these skills is that you don't have to spend a standard action of cast the spell/read the scroll/quaff the potion/activate the magic item. Then again, Slippers of Spider Climbing cost only 4,800gp and don't have to be activated as far as I can tell.

 

[Saeviomagy]

I'll tell you what you use jump for.

Make jumping charges.

Frankly - you want to climb/run up a tree and fight people standing on the branches, but you don't have climb OR balance? Gee, wonder why you're not gonna succeed.

The non-fantasy aspect of the fight wasn't due to you, the jump rules or anything else. It was due to the DM ambushing you with the viet cong. Do that and of course the tone is gonna get gritty.

 

[JoeBlank]

My 3 foot 5 inch gnome sorcerer, 11th level with a 6 Str, had to make a crucial jump check for a standing vertical leap in this weekend's game session. He of course has no ranks in jump, and therefore has a net -2.

The party was teleporting to a safe location from the underdark. We had retreated to a tunnel we thought was safe, but Sully, the gnome, could not take the entire party in one casting. He had to leave behind one dwarf and his riding lizard, with a promise to come back for him instantly. As the rest of the party teleported out we just glimpsed the two displacer beasts approaching. Sully knew he had to hop back quickly.

The dwarf was new to the party and did not know the routine related to the spell. He ordered his riding lizard to climb up the wall of the tunnel, to the ceiling, apparently in an attempt to buy time and avoid the displacers. When Sully teleported back to the spot he had just left, he looked up to see the dwarf a few feet above him. And the displacers were already attacking. Sully couldn't explain well enough to convince the stubborn dwarf to come back down to ground level because he had to touch him to affect him with the teleport spell.

So I had to make a jump check, admittedly not by much but not something this character usually does. And for a standing vertical leap to boot. Somehow I made the jump check, grabbed onto the dwarf, and then made the concentration check to cast teleport while threatened by the displacer beasts, porting to safety. All in all a fun, tense moment out of what we had expected to be a routine escape to end the session.

 

[Prism]

I would agree with a number of others who said that it really depends on the DM's inclusion of situational factors in combat as to how useful skills like jump are

Our group played in the rpga open tourney last year and the monk with his huge movement and decent jump skill absolutely ruled some of the combats as they were designed to be pretty difficult to actually get to the bad guys - rooms full of lava, deep chasms, pits of endless mist. The monk just lept across and kept the main casters busy while the rest of us took our time casting fly spells etc

 

[Kilroy]

I'm afraid you're remembering incorrectly. My group still only plays 3.0. In my PHB, monks have jump as a class skill, and no limitation based on their height (a nonissue in 3.5), and that's it.

Im afraid you're wrong. In 3.0, distance jumped was multiplied by speed, so if you're 3 times faster than a normal person, as high level monks usually are, you can jump 3 times as high. For a 90' base move monk, a 10' jump is trivial in 3.0 and impossible in 3.5.

 

[Kilroy]

My 3 foot 5 inch gnome sorcerer, 11th level with a 6 Str, had to make a crucial jump check for a standing vertical leap in this weekend's game session. He of course has no ranks in jump, and therefore has a net -2.

Net minus 8, counting the -6 for having a 20' base move. Your maximum jump check of 12 (a natural 20) will get you a solid 18 inches off the ground.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Im afraid you're wrong. In 3.0, distance jumped was multiplied by speed, so if you're 3 times faster than a normal person, as high level monks usually are, you can jump 3 times as high. For a 3.0 monk moving 90', a 10' jump is trivial in 3.0 and impossible in 3.5.

I believe the multiplication for speed is only for running jumps.

 

[Kilroy]

On one hand, it sucks that you couldn't use your jump to good effect, but on the other hand...20 archers each with 80 hp in some trees vs. a monk with no balance or climb and a vow of poverty seems like a dumb fight to just run into.

Yeah, unfortunantly, we didn't see them until we were surrounded because it was dark out. Even the enemy druid riding a triceratops started out 40' away.

Come to think of it, we've never had an encounter take place at farther than about 60' away. That may explain the party aversion to ranged weapons.

Generally jump can be made much better with a mix of climb and balance.
You said your balance was +0 (I think, sorry if I'm wrong), which would mean you have a 10 dexterity? Possibly investing more in dexterity or intelligence would have been a good idea.

Yeah, it would have been, but I started out with (rolled) three +0 stats, a +1, and two +3s. Starting as a cleric, it really made sense to put a +3 in Wisdom, the other +3 in Cha (not knowing it was a mostly undead-free game, it still fits the character concept) and the +1 in Con. Since then, I've been working on Con, and the number of times the character would have been killed without it (probably over a dozen) makes that worthwhile.

Dex might be my next skill increase, but Int is a totally useless stat to raise at higher levels, for non-int casters, because it doesn't help retroactivly.