Why is ENWorld so against anyone that post anything critical about 4E. It seems that the surest way to get dogpiled on this forum is to say anything the slightest bit negative about 4E. The worst part is that the moderators seem as bad or worse than the posters. It seems that anytime someone posts something critical of 4E they either get warned, the thread is closed, or they may even get banned or suspended. What happened to open discussion? Why is the moderation of these boards so heavy-handed? Ari's thread about his playtest experience is a prime example of this. As soon as people started airing WotC's dirty laundry about their "If you can't say anythign good about 4E, don't say nothing at all." e-mail, the thread got shut down. Has ENWorld been paid off by WOtC or what? Does anyone have a good explanation for this?
D&D 4E Why is this board so down on 4E critics?
- Thread starter Shazman
- Start date
Wolfspider
Explorer
Oh boy. 
Hope you are wearing some armor of fortification, my friend....
Hope you are wearing some armor of fortification, my friend....
FourthBear
First Post
No complicated motivations needed. It's simply human social dynamics. I've never seen any issue that doesn't naturally gravitate towards towards people feeling like there are sides that need defending. Honest disagreements, confused misunderstandings, questionable humor, insulting comparisons and poor argumentation are all par for the course in any forum that I've seen. There were plenty of nasty, drag-down fights between the Old Guard and the 3e Turks back in the day. I think the fights on initiative alone took up more space than what I've seen on 4e total. It would be nice if both sides ramped down the rhetoric, but wishing it won't make it so. All we can do is control what we post ourselves and which replies we pay attention to.
vagabundo
Adventurer
I'm definitely in the positive camp about 4e and I come to the boards to dissect the new edition as each new titbit is unearthed. A new edition does not come around very often so I want to enjoy it.
There are some posters who are very negative about 4e for a variety of reasons, I'm all for constructive criticism and finding out how other play the game. The discussions about 4e often bring this up and it is interesting, but I have to wonder at some posters who are constantly negative on the 4e board. Why bother?
I think there can be lots of criticism levelled at some of the info in 4e, but at this stage we cannot see the whole picture and the broad sweeping strokes of some posters and negativity can "ruin me buzz"!
I understand that some peoples playstyles will not work well with 4e and they will have a tough decision to make come game time...
There are some posters who are very negative about 4e for a variety of reasons, I'm all for constructive criticism and finding out how other play the game. The discussions about 4e often bring this up and it is interesting, but I have to wonder at some posters who are constantly negative on the 4e board. Why bother?
I think there can be lots of criticism levelled at some of the info in 4e, but at this stage we cannot see the whole picture and the broad sweeping strokes of some posters and negativity can "ruin me buzz"!
I understand that some peoples playstyles will not work well with 4e and they will have a tough decision to make come game time...
Well Enworld is pretty much one of the biggest community forums for D&D. With many 4E critics camping the official forums, it seems several of the optimists decided to camp over here. So what you describe as dogpiling is mostly the result of a majority number of optimists among the active posters.
As for moderation, I think the moderators stop threads that are consumed by flame wars mostly. And they probably suspend users who try to debate their opinion against a dozen other people who are against it, and in the end, maybe excusably, resort to less than rational argumentation, since they get frustrated by the aforementioned dogpiling.
Try for example to post anything positive about the Forgotten Realms on the official forums
You will get flamed to oblivion, and unlike here, the moderators will not do much to stop the discussion.
As for moderation, I think the moderators stop threads that are consumed by flame wars mostly. And they probably suspend users who try to debate their opinion against a dozen other people who are against it, and in the end, maybe excusably, resort to less than rational argumentation, since they get frustrated by the aforementioned dogpiling.
Try for example to post anything positive about the Forgotten Realms on the official forums
You will get flamed to oblivion, and unlike here, the moderators will not do much to stop the discussion.
Klaus
First Post
I think it's not "criticizing 4e" that gets dogpiled, it's the way you do it. I have seen enough strawmen construed to demean 4e to patrol every crop in Kansas. Some people criticize 4e for stuff that isn't known yet, others for stuff that has been expanded/clarified already, and who tend to get vicious in their defense of whatever edition they like best.Shazman said:
Be polite and have a clear argument, and the boards will be better for it.
Matrix Sorcica
Hero
No need for flames.
I don't agree with your view. But, to try and answer why so many threads get closed and posters suspended/banned, I think it's because so many threads end up being attacks on WotC employees (more or less direct) or more or less unfounded conspiracires about the evilness of WotC.
IMO, 4E threads should be about the game and one's hopes (and fears) about 4E and not really much else. Especially the rights and wrongs of the designers and company behind.
Just my opinion of course, but I think to a certain degree it's shared by many posters on this board, including the moderators.
I don't agree with your view. But, to try and answer why so many threads get closed and posters suspended/banned, I think it's because so many threads end up being attacks on WotC employees (more or less direct) or more or less unfounded conspiracires about the evilness of WotC.
IMO, 4E threads should be about the game and one's hopes (and fears) about 4E and not really much else. Especially the rights and wrongs of the designers and company behind.
Just my opinion of course, but I think to a certain degree it's shared by many posters on this board, including the moderators.
(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
Yes, this is on-topic.
I'm a big fan of StarCraft and eagerly follow the development of the sequel, StarCraft II. It's going to be different, just like 4e will be different from 3e, and it will be more of the same (just like 4e will be more of the same).
There, we get the exact dsame histrionics, hatred, hyperbole, exaggerations, and personal attacks, so I find it amusing that many DnD boards are exactly the same way.
I think the anti-4e people see themselves on the "losing side". They know they'll probably lose. 4e will probably be popular, and WotC isn't going to listen to them anyway, so they're frustrated and maybe lash out more. (It certainly seems that way to me when it comes to StarCraft II haters).
I'm a big fan of StarCraft and eagerly follow the development of the sequel, StarCraft II. It's going to be different, just like 4e will be different from 3e, and it will be more of the same (just like 4e will be more of the same).
There, we get the exact dsame histrionics, hatred, hyperbole, exaggerations, and personal attacks, so I find it amusing that many DnD boards are exactly the same way.
I think the anti-4e people see themselves on the "losing side". They know they'll probably lose. 4e will probably be popular, and WotC isn't going to listen to them anyway, so they're frustrated and maybe lash out more. (It certainly seems that way to me when it comes to StarCraft II haters).
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