Why no Half-elf/Half-orcs?

[Kae'Yoss]

Not to be cranky or anything, but is an abortion discussion really where we want this thread to go? If ever there was a combination of religion and politics, it is the topic of abortion.

Only if we start talking about whether it's right or wrong or should be allowed or not, not if we just mention the fact that it happens and is possible (And, for the record: I'm against abortion but for the killing of babies. That way everybody loses, and I win!)

 

[Achan hiArusa]

Actually this does happen in "real life" you don't have to pull the concept of "fantasy genetics." The vervet monkey Cercopithecus aetheiopus consists of 16 subspecies that surround Lake Victoria. They can interbreed with both of their immediate neighbors and up to two or three down the line, but can't interbreed with species directly across the lake from them or the immediate neighbors of those across the lake.

It can also be something as simple as the Rh factor. Any child with orc genes activates the immune system of the elf causing miscarriage and the opposite also happens, whereas the human immune system doesn't recognize those genetic markers.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

It can also be something as simple as the Rh factor. Any child with orc genes activates the immune system of the elf causing miscarriage and the opposite also happens, whereas the human immune system doesn't recognize those genetic markers.

hrm, humans are RhO and RhE positive, elves are RhE positive but RhO negative, orcs the opposite.... It would have to be more extreme than actual Rh factors of course, as it's the second Rh+ pregnancy that usually has problems iirc.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

hrm, humans are RhO and RhE positive, elves are RhE positive but RhO negative, orcs the opposite.... It would have to be more extreme than actual Rh factors of course, as it's the second Rh+ pregnancy that usually has problems iirc.

I take all that gibberish and reply with a firm "Frikkin' Magic!"

 

[Zurai]

Not to be cranky or anything, but is an abortion discussion really where we want this thread to go? If ever there was a combination of religion and politics, it is the topic of abortion.

Where's the discussion? Someone mentioned that abortions would probably be possible, and I semi-confirmed it. That's the entire sum total of the abortion references in this thread. No-one even mentioned the merits of abortion or brought up any opinions on the matter one way or the other.

 

[Aeolius]

Real Life: zebra + horse = zorse, zebra + donkey = zonkey

D&D: Night hag + human = greenhag, greenhag + ogre = annis

Weirdness abounds

 

[jdrakeh]

It has been a while since I looked -- but isn't this where mongrel men come from? I believe that there was an old AD&D adventure that offered up this pearl of wisdom.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

But if orcs have a society, and if they interact with humans in any way except killing each other (and evil humans using orcish warbands to help them attack other humans is, one could say, supported in "the literature") then there is oppertunity for half-orcs of varied backstories.

That is exactly my point- up until fairly recently, there simply weren't any orc societies interacting with humans in any other way except as barbarian tribes of killers and raiders (sometimes in the thrall of evil humans).

Even in settings like the Forgotten Realms, orcs without a violent predisposition towards humanity & elves were the rare individuals, not representative exemplars of any kind of larger group.

Only if "elf", "orc" and "human" are each a single gene. The Half-elf would be EH, the Half-orc would be OH, and you have four possible interbreedings - EH, HH, OH, and EO, with equal probability.

But really, "efishness" and "orcitude" would each be a whole collection of genes, and a cross-breed would have, on average, 50% of the genes from the human grandparents, 25% from the orc grandparent, and 25% from the elf grandparent.

As I implied, D&D genetics is only a passing similarity to RW genetics- humans have much more variation than depicted in the game, and the 2 most common hybrids- HE & HO should similarly have more variation.

But they don't. Instead, the game mechanics reveal that D&D has the attitude of "Humans is humans, Orcs is Orcs," etc. Elf & Orc genetics is boiled down to "efishness" and "orcitude" that combines with humanity in a simple 100% Punnet-predictable way.

Thus, with that mechanical treatment, the 4 results interbreedings - EH, HH, OH, and EO- should follow with equal probability.

 

[Umbran]

As I implied, D&D genetics is only a passing similarity to RW genetics- humans have much more variation than depicted in the game

I dunno about that. Genetically speaking, humans have very little variation. We are all very, very similar. Human stats range from 3 to 18. If you use dice, they follow a bell curve. That's not enough variation?

But they don't. Instead, the game mechanics reveal that D&D has the attitude of "Humans is humans, Orcs is Orcs," etc. Elf & Orc genetics is boiled down to "efishness" and "orcitude" that combines with humanity in a simple 100% Punnet-predictable way.

The thing is, the first cross breeding (half-elf and half-orc) are pretty reasonable depictions of the general effects of mixing two complex bloodlines. The problems arise when you get to 1/4 bloods.

But, really, it may not be much of a problem. With dogs, for example, once you've got three different beasts in the mix, it is a "mutt", and has few meaningful traits that you can clearly point to and say that it comes from one breed or another.

 

[Shortman McLeod]

Where's the discussion? Someone mentioned that abortions would probably be possible, and I semi-confirmed it. That's the entire sum total of the abortion references in this thread. No-one even mentioned the merits of abortion or brought up any opinions on the matter one way or the other.

Ironically, you decided to point out that there was no discussion, thus raising the issue again.