Why the ELH didn't do it for me...

[Psion]

As long as we are talking about "what's epic" -- I have always thought that some of the more significant characters in Brust's Dragaera books were pretty Epic. Mario, Kiera, Sethra Lavode... both of them were arguably epic characters.

(spoiler: yes, I said "both".)

 

[Umbran]

Magic items: Bland, bland, bland. This is where the book really failed to stir me. I want unbelievably ubercool unique items of ungoldy power..

Yeah, well, there's a problem - as soon as it shows up in a mass market book, it isn't unique, now is it? Simply everybody who has an epic character will immediately have all the "cool" things printed , and they would immediately cease to be cool.

That, an the fact that it's nigh impossible to balance really over-the-top stuff. You don't need game designers to produce materials that are not balanceable. You can do that with your own imagination. You need designers to do things that are tested, and that means structure, and thus a lack of uniqueness.

 

[Greatwyrm]

I guess I'm going to have to see this lack of soul for myself. I'm not questioning the validity of everyone's comments to this effect. I just don't get it.

The PHB didn't seem to me like it had a lot of uumph to it either. That doesn't really bother me. I always figured the rules themselves were like a vehicle. It's where and how you choose to drive that makes a car exciting.

Again, haven't seen it yet. And I admit, this is a confused and somewhat uninformed opinion.

 

[Lizard]

Re: Re: Why the ELH didn't do it for me...

Yeah, well, there's a problem - as soon as it shows up in a mass market book, it isn't unique, now is it? Simply everybody who has an epic character will immediately have all the "cool" things printed , and they would immediately cease to be cool.

This is true. But there is a point between 'utterly unique in the multiverse' and '+2...+4...+6...+8...Hey! I know! Plus TEN!"

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

These phrases gave me a Dunsany feel.

Beyond The Fields We Know.

Paladins in armor made of liquid diamond wielding swords of emerald steel which crackle with the power of a living soul. A mage riding a dragon made of bone and iron, destroying a city with a gesture. Rogues who can steal the sun from the sky or the color from a maiden's eyes.

The first is a phrase he used several times (and was used as a title for a compilation of his stuff put out in the '70's.

The rest of it is the kind of thing you might find hiding just outside the pages of his books. They're not actually on the page, but you can feel them hanging around when you read some of his work. Although what he's really good at is the mystery of exotic locales and the power of dreams.

Sorry. I'm on a kick with random tangents today.

 

[Lizard]

Re: Re: Why the ELH didn't do it for me...

These phrases gave me a Dunsany feel.



The first is a phrase he used several times (and was used as a title for a compilation of his stuff put out in the '70's.

Probably where I got it from. There's endless stuff I have picked up via osmosis and seeing it reused in other people's work.

 

[Umbran]

Re: Re: Re: Why the ELH didn't do it for me...

This is true. But there is a point between 'utterly unique in the multiverse' and '+2...+4...+6...+8...Hey! I know! Plus TEN!"

*shrug*
You cannot expect WOTC to change the fundamental feel of the game in such a supplement. One needs to expect a logical, working extension, not a whole new world nobody's seen before.

If you want things fundamentally not the basic D&D paradigm. Things really unique, you'll need to go to a 3rd party publisher.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Why the ELH didn't do it for me...

*shrug*
You cannot expect WOTC to change the fundamental feel of the game in such a supplement. One needs to expect a logical, working extension, not a whole new world nobody's seen before.

Again, I haven't read the thing yet, and would be happy to be proved wrong...

But it sounds like they introduced some new mechanics for spellcasters that fit the system. But they blew the load on that and monsters, leaving the more mundane classes with nothing that interesting to play with. They just get more 'o the same.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Nightfall mate!

Perhaps Lizard should talk to my mate Krusty about epic level stuff. I think you'd find what he's talking about very interesting.

I am confident you will find my magic items, monsters and spells interesting...

I can easily facilitate Lizards scope.

Incidently I am also a Kirby fan; or more specifically a fan of the Mighty Thor!

I have to admit I am very intrigued by this 'Arduin Grimoire' you mention Lizard!? Can you tell us a bit more?

 

[Nightfall]

I have never doubted that Krusty mate. I just hope you'lll take the time to address some of the concerns people have raised about how to implement Epic level campaign ideas as well as working divine stuff and epic stuff as well.