Why the love for the Edition Treadmill?

[S'mon]

I have no love for the edition treadmill. If I buy a new edition it's because I was burnt out on the old one, or always disliked it.

That said, if 2e Pathfinder looks like the Beginner Box, I'll buy it. But that's because I dislike the PF Core/3e presentation. The BB presentation looks much much cleaner.

 

[Weregrognard]

We gamers are a fickle lot.

 

[Ulrick]

I have books and materials for OD&D, BECMI, AD&D, AD&D 2e, 3e, 3.5e, and Pathfinder. I had some stuff for 4e, but sold it once I realised the game wasn't for me (or wasn't intended for me).

At this point, its time to get off the treadmill.

I certainly haven't lost any weight walking on the edition treadmill.
I have all these books that are a pain to move.
And quite frankly, I'm really tired of seeing Forgotten Realms get re-hashed.


Now with that said:
I would totally be on board with 5e if WotC also focused on the things that inspired D&D in the first place--science fiction/fantasy stories, real world history, fantasy and historical wargaming. (Hell, throw in some Harry Potter-like elements or even some inspirational movies). For example: Back in the day Dragon Magazine wasn't just a "D&D" magazine. It promoted other aspects of gaming culture.

Basically what I'm saying is:

APPENDIX N!!!

 

[Desdichado]

The short lifespan of 4e is, in my opinion, best described by one of two models.

1) 4e was seen as a "failure" in some way by WotC--either in capturing the market share of players of D&D-style games, or on some other way. The relatively fast release of 5e is an attempt to "reverse" the effects of that failure and reclaim D&D's place as undisputed king of the hill.

Or,

2) Due to Hasbro's continued insistence on short term profits and the short term profitability of new editions, this is just the new schedule. We can expect the next editions to be announced three and a half years after the release of a new one, with actual release dates five years or less apart.

Personally, I believe it's 1) because 2) is rather depressing to think about in many ways. Not that I'm overly concerned personally--I never bought--or even played--a single game of 4e, although I did flip through a few of the books here and there, and if that remains true for 5e, 6e, 7e. etc. then I can live with that.

 

[SkredlitheOgre]

I wasn't aware I wanted Pathfinder 2E. Huh. The things you learn when you come to EN World.

Seriously, if PF 2E came out tomorrow or next week, I'd do the same thing I did with 3/3.5, 4E, PF and 5E when it comes out: I'll look it over and see if I think it's something I'd be interested in playing. If so, I'll give it a shot. If not, then I'll stick with what I'm playing now. For me, there is no love for the 'edition treadmill.' As a friend of mine pointed out yesterday, 2E lasted for 12 years as the official edition of D&D. In the past 12 years, we've already had four rules systems (3, 3.5, PF and 4E) and could possible end up with five. It makes no sense.

 

[delericho]

I'm not dead keen on the edition cycle, but it has happened to suit me quite well.

I started with BECMI D&D. Just as I was hitting what I saw as the limits of that system, TSR released 2nd Edition. So, the timing was right for me.

Some years later, I had fallen out of love with, and then back in love with, D&D. I was just getting back to the game (from Vampire, FWIW) when 3e was announced. The timing was exactly right.

3e was a revelation to me. It was immediately obvious that this was the game I didn't know I always wanted. But, as time went on, the imperfections started to get to me.

And so, when 4e was announced, I was ready for a new edition. Yes, please!

Sadly, 4e just didn't grab me. And while Pathfinder is, on balance, an improvement over 3.5e, it isn't "better enough" to persuade me to throw away my accumulated system knowledge (although it's getting damn close...).

So, under those circumstances, another edition change just happens to suit me really well. I will welcome 5e... if and only if it is a good edition. (Natually, by my own entirely subjective assessment at the time!)

But I'm also tired of the Edition Wars. So, I won't be repeating the mistakes of the last few years. If 5e is good, then great, but if it doesn't grab me, I'm afraid I'm done - I won't bother waiting for any eventual 6e.

 

[Dausuul]

A week ago, however, for the 4e fans, it was still the best edition of the game ever made.

So for the 4e fans that are now ready to move to 5e, how did the announcement change things? Why?

It didn't change anything for me. I'm a 4E player and DM, but I have a lot of gripes about the game and I've been griping about them for years. Just because something is good doesn't mean there isn't room to make it better, and I do think 4E threw out a few babies with all the bathwater. (I used to use the status "edition war mercenary" because in any given edition war you could find me fighting for BD&D, AD&D, 3E, or 4E depending on the topic.)

4E was a bold experiment. In some ways it was a success. In others it was a failure. And in a lot of places it was a failure but could have been a success with more polish and playtesting. I'm excited about 5E because I see it as WotC's opportunity to build on the successes and learn from the failures, and because the team they have in place seems like about the best team they could have to do that.

I do find the whole thing terribly funny, though. With all of the different vesions of D&D out there - OD&D, Holmes D&D, 1e AD&D, Moldvay D&D, Mentzer BECMI D&D, 2e AD&D, 3e D&D, 3.5e D&D, 4e D&D, plus all of the OGL derivatives, from C&C to Pathfinder to the retro-clones - people are still hoping the next edition will be THE ONE.

5E isn't going to be THE ONE. THE ONE went out of print in 1989 or so. What we have now is THE FOUR, coming up on THE FIVE.

But more seriously--no, I don't expect 5E to be a perfect jewel of a game. By this time in 2017, I'll be snarking about all the stuff 5E got wrong, and right about then Wizards will announce 6E. And you know what? I'm cool with that. The game is never perfect, but my hope is that it will get better each time around. For me, at least, that's been the case so far.

 

[Aberzanzorax]

My excitement for 5e comes with the hope that it will end the edition treadmill.

If it is truly modular, and it can support all prior editions, perhaps it can become more of an evergreen product, and perhaps it may open up production lines for WotC for prior editions again as well.

 

[vagabundo]

I believe there is a huge amount of content out there for 4e and the system itself allows for the creation of your own content easier than ever. I'm happy for 5e to come along. 4/5 years of support is go enough for me and I like new things to get excited about.

As far as I'm concerned the edition "treadmill", as you put it, is part of the hobby.

I do adore many things with 4e, but I'm hoping for some great improvements and the hints that have been dropped put me in a good mood so far. I'm really hoping for some solid electronic support for 5e I'm hoping they have learned a lot from DDI. Embrace iOS and Android and release DDI apps for it, allow cross platform browser support, etc...

 

[Randomthoughts]

A week ago, however, for the 4e fans, it was still the best edition of the game ever made.

So for the 4e fans that are now ready to move to 5e, how did the announcement change things? Why?

Did the announcement of 5e suddenly show you that those 4e critics were right all along?

<snip>

I don't understand the desire for a new edition for games that haven't been out even 5 years. <snip> Honestly, I'm weary of it.

4e is the best version of D&D for me. I came late to the 4e party, and I'm glad I did (missing the brunt of the Edition Wars and some early rule changes). I'm getting the sense though that the ire of 4e critics are mainly due to (1) the marketing snafus when rolling out 4e and (2) the game doesn't suit their preferences. It seems (1) is a legitimate concern (I've read) and (2), well, to each their own.

But I agree with Dausuul's statement that 4e was a "bold experiment." It certainly was. And I'm glad WotC did it.

That being said, I don't care for the edition treadmill. OTOH, I want companies who design games I play to stay in business. The primary way they do that is to sell Core Rules, so I'll buy them if I like them. But I'm very open to other models of revenue like DDI, kickstarts and whatnot.