Will Dragon cultural/politcal climate stay the same ?

[Piratecat]

And those dragons who don't are those whho only sit in their cave doing nothing until teh adventurers come and slay them.

Goodness, no. I have no problem coming up with a half-dozen dragon-related political adventures just off the top of my head. Not casting magic spells doesn't mean that a dragon adventure can't be logically consistent, fun, and exciting.

So I guess I disagree with your basic premise that it was dragons' spellcasting that made them interesting. For me, that wasn't the case.

 

[vagabundo]

If the dragon approaches a hunter and tells him to deliver a message than most likely the whole town will know about that dragon. Influencing the politics of that town is impossible than as everyone will be on the guard. Also to be really into politics the dragon needs regular contact with the people he influences.

And those dragons who don't are those whho only sit in their cave doing nothing until teh adventurers come and slay them. The only thing they can do is maybe to threaten some small villages and raid caravans. But that are heroic tier adventures suitable for level 1-10 adventurers. So either the dragon is just a low level monster or the dragon does not function properly.

Gerric the hunter gaped at the monstrous Wrym in front of him. Until now he had believed them only to be legend.

"BE STILL HUMAN, DO AS I COMMAND AND I WILL NOT HARM YOU"

It's giant red scales bristled as its voice echoed through the clearing. Gerric felt his guts tighten, his legs buckled and he fell to his knees. His hatchet fell from shaking fingers.

"ARE YOU FROM THE SETTLEMENT YONDER", its head nodded to the west.

"Y-yess, it is called Taskia"

"TELL ME ABOUT YOUR TASKIA".

The Dragon interrogated Gerric for several hours and learned all he knew about the small town of his birth. Finally he sent Gerric to the mayor of the town with a message demanding he come to the clearing in ten days hence or the town will be destroyed.

Gerric went straight to the major, fearing the panic it would cause he told noone else of the dragon.

The mayor met the Dragon, with only the fearless captain of the guard for company, agreed to pay the Dragon tribute of cattle and treasure in the clearing every month. The Dragon added another town to his growing list of conquests.

The dragon offered his protection to the town and would defend it against other Dragons or large threats. Over time the Dragon, through guile, befriended some of the humans entrusted with the delivery of his tribute. He begin to learn more of the secrets of Taskia and using his agents, supreme intellect and long attention span, manipulated the growing town.

The tribute to the Dragon became a dark secret in Taskia, until one day , blah blah....

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Except in D&D. There dragons have a tradition of being spellcasters.

Great, now every time the PCs slay a dragon they a wagons full of magical items the dragon needed to function properly. So much for balance.

A Headband of Sending and a Staff of Alarm are hardly unbalancing. Unless off course 4E default assumption still includes magic item shops in every town and city. Though not more so then the Dragon hoard itself in the first place

If I remember correctly, Dragons in the MM 3.5 have a Treasure Entry that says something like "Triple Standard" (or was it even more?). Dragons always had a lot of stuff to be taken after being killed...

 

[shilsen]

In their endless wisdom WotC removed the alignment from the dragons so it is now a free for all.

No, it was my endless wisdom, since I did that years ago. WotC just followed me.

Also it looks like dragons won't be able to do any politics or intrigues anymore beyond "burn dowm small village" as they won't have the tools for that (magic) anymore.

As people on this thread have already pointed out, there are a lot of ways to handle politics and intrigue sans magic. Why don't you start a thread on the General RPG Discussion board asking for ideas, if you're having trouble coming up with them? I'm sure you'll get a lot of useful suggestions.

 

[Derren]

Why don't you start a thread on the General RPG Discussion board asking for ideas, if you're having trouble coming up with them? I'm sure you'll get a lot of useful suggestions.

Good idea. Here is it.
http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?p=3987718#post3987718

So if you think that I am wrong post a intrigue there with the rules I stated. I'm especially interested in hear some of the ideas Piratecat had.

 

[I'm A Banana]

To go back to the OP:

And what I mean by that is will the old relationships stay the same ?

I'd give it a snowball's chance in hell.

HTH!

 

[Stormborn]

Any dragon of any size or age regardless of spellcasting can engage in politics and intrigue. In fact MMV has a section on "Dragons of the Great Game" in which a dragon gives up his or her innate spellcasting ability inorder to better manipulate minions, to interact tellepathicyally with other xorvintaal (great game) dragons, and to gain powers as it advanced in the game. Given what we know about Dragons in 4e I can't help but wonder if we aren't seeing there an example of what dragons might do in the future.

(Oh, and is it just me or does there seem to be a lot of confusion between "mayor" and "major" in this thread? Or is it some shift of spelling I am not aware of?)

 

[Derren]

Any dragon of any size or age regardless of spellcasting can engage in politics and intrigue. In fact MMV has a section on "Dragons of the Great Game" in which a dragon gives up his or her innate spellcasting ability inorder to better manipulate minions, to interact tellepathicyally with other xorvintaal (great game) dragons, and to gain powers as it advanced in the game. Given what we know about Dragons in 4e I can't help but wonder if we aren't seeing there an example of what dragons might do in the future.

(Oh, and is it just me or does there seem to be a lot of confusion between "mayor" and "major" in this thread? Or is it some shift of spelling I am not aware of?)

The problem is that while the flavor text says they can do that, they lack the tools necessary for that task.....

 

[Someone]

The problem is that while the flavor text says they can do that, they lack the tools necessary for that task.....

Like the destructive potential of a large army, genius intelligence, long lifespan, great charisma and commanding and intimidating presence, lots of skills, and immense wealth?

You still seem to assume that because a dragon is a large quadruped nobody's going to speak with him (I've not heard you complaining about dragonborn, which are also lizards and supposedly can also gain the ability to fly and breathe fire at later levels) nor can a entity with intelligence vastly surpasing our own be able to devise a way to be trusted or simply obeyed by whoever he wants, or keep his influence secret, or nobody is going to think on them as a way to increase their own personal power. If people is able to make pacts with devils, which are always evil they are surely able to make pacts with dragons, which are only sometimes evil.

What magic was so supremely important for dragons for being able to be involved in politics?

 

[small pumpkin man]

The problem is that while the flavor text says they can do that, they lack the tools necessary for that task.....

In your opinion. You're assuming both that Dragons cannot use tools, and more importantly, that Dragons are unable to socialize with the humanoid races. I think you should be aware by now that not everyone shares these assumptions.

In regards to the actual topic, on an intellectual level, I would hope that they keep some and try to build on them, but I don't honestly think they will, as they seem to care even less than I do about D&Disms (and I don't care a great deal).