Wizards Spellbooks as scrolls...

[Uriel]

Can a Wizard (who has just acquired a spellbook and knows a spell fromit), use a page as a Scroll?

Was this not the case in 3.0, that a Wizard could 'burn' a spell, erasing it, to cast the spell as a 1-shot.
If this isn't the case (specifically in 3.5), please point it out, thanks...


-Uriel

 

[Pax]

Not in 3.0, nor in 3.5

Were spellbook entries useable as scrolls, then, scribing a spell into your book would have to cost the same as scribing a scroll of that spell. Including the ever-valued experience points for same.

 

[naturaltwenty]

SRD searching

[SRD]Activate the Spell: Activating a scroll requires reading the spell from the scroll. The character must be able to see and read the writing on the scroll. Activating a scroll spell requires no material components or focus. (The creator of the scroll provided these when scribing the scroll.) Note that some spells are effective only when cast on an item or items. In such a case, the scroll user must provide the item when activating the spell. Activating a scroll spell is subject to disruption just as casting a normally prepared spell would be. Using a scroll is like casting a spell for purposes of arcane spell failure chance.
To have any chance of activating a scroll spell, the scroll user must meet the following requirements.[/SRD]

Interpretation only here but the above quote is from the SRD pertaining to scrolls. The comment in (), i.e. The creator of the scroll provided these when scribing the scroll, is where it could argued that a spellbook, when created, indicates which material components are used in the spell (like a recipe book) instead of actually containing the magic used in scroll creation. So the spellbook itself does not contain an actual precast spell but it only the instructions for such spells.

Later,

Natural Twenty

Can a Wizard (who has just acquired a spellbook and knows a spell fromit), use a page as a Scroll?

Was this not the case in 3.0, that a Wizard could 'burn' a spell, erasing it, to cast the spell as a 1-shot.
If this isn't the case (specifically in 3.5), please point it out, thanks...


-Uriel

 

[Endur]

In D&D/AD&D, wizard spellbook pages could be treated as scrolls.

Unfortunately, in D&D 3.0/3.5, wizard spellbooks are not the same as scrolls. And this is a major defect in my opinion, it would be much easier to just treat all spellbook pages as scrolls.

Can a Wizard (who has just acquired a spellbook and knows a spell fromit), use a page as a Scroll?

 

[Pax]

No, Endur, that was a widely-used house rule in 1E, and IIRC in 2E as well ... but it was not a stated, explicit core rule.

And again, you would have to charge the full XP cost of the scroll -- along with additional cost for the material components and foci -- whenever any spell was scribed into said spellbook.

Otherwise, for certain spells, it would become FAR cheaper to continually srcibe them into a spellbook, over and over, rather than scribe scrolls of that spell.

What would you rather pay for a scroll of Wish (at caster level 17) -- 900gp ... or ... 28,825gp ... ?

Allowing spellbook pages to be used as scrolls is not balanced under third-edition rules (pre- or post-revision). Not even close.

 

[the Jester]

No, Endur, that was a widely-used house rule in 1E, and IIRC in 2E as well ... but it was not a stated, explicit core rule.

Actually, in 1e Unearthed Arcana, the rules for using spellbooks like scrolls in extremis were spelled out.

There was a chance that it'd also wipe out neighboring spells- or your entire book!- when you used a page as a scroll, iirc.

 

[Endur]

Pax, you missed my point. The point is that under the 1e approach, whether I'm remembering it from the DMG or Dragon, the idea was that a scroll would cost the same as a spellbook page. There wouldn't be any difference in price.

The rule I'm thinking of is from before Unearthed Arcana. The idea was that spell books weren't really a "book", but might in fact be a collection of scrolls. The difference was whether you wanted to use the page to memorize a spell and cast it yourself, or just cast the spell off the page without memorizing (in which case you erased the page).

 

[Nellisir]

You could house-rule the use of spellbooks as scrolls, but instead of the scriber paying the xp cost, the caster has to pay (in addition to any normally imposed). It'd make creating spellbooks pretty easy, but casting from them an action of desperation.

Cheers
Nell
The Babellian

 

[Staffan]

You could house-rule the use of spellbooks as scrolls, but instead of the scriber paying the xp cost, the caster has to pay (in addition to any normally imposed). It'd make creating spellbooks pretty easy, but casting from them an action of desperation.

That's still unbalanced. For 5th-level spells and above, the scribing cost for the spell book would be less than the creation cost of a scroll.

 

[Nellisir]

That's still unbalanced. For 5th-level spells and above, the scribing cost for the spell book would be less than the creation cost of a scroll.

I'm flying without a DMG here, so...maybe add a failure rate. DC to cast from a spell from a spellbook equals level squared, plus xp costs.