World's Largest Dungeon in actual play [Spoilers!]
- Thread starter haiiro
- Start date
erucsbo
Explorer
jim pinto said:
Ah HA!
we now have the verbal component of the Summon Jim Pinto spell
But seriously Jim - your book has spawned the largest thread on ENWorld (even discounting the 600 posts lost in the server crash), countless adventure blogs, an audio podcast (rpgmp3) and more hours of roleplaying (at least for my group) than any other three 'adventure' modules combined.
We pick at it because we enjoy it. If we didn't then it would be dropped and we would move on to something else. We post the problems we have with it because we want others to play it as well - and enjoy doing so (otherwise why bother - since our own groups would have moved past the area we are bitching about).
You don't need to defend yourself, nor even the writers who screwed up and caused you such angst (such is the burden of an editor) - but hearing the stories behind its creation, ideas for mixing things up, and explanations for how things are supposed to work are always welcome.
jim pinto
First Post
erucsbo said:Ah HA!
we now have the verbal component of the Summon Jim Pinto spell
But seriously Jim - your book has spawned the largest thread on ENWorld (even discounting the 600 posts lost in the server crash), countless adventure blogs, an audio podcast (rpgmp3) and more hours of roleplaying (at least for my group) than any other three 'adventure' modules combined.
We pick at it because we enjoy it. If we didn't then it would be dropped and we would move on to something else. We post the problems we have with it because we want others to play it as well - and enjoy doing so (otherwise why bother - since our own groups would have moved past the area we are bitching about).
You don't need to defend yourself, nor even the writers who screwed up and caused you such angst (such is the burden of an editor) - but hearing the stories behind its creation, ideas for mixing things up, and explanations for how things are supposed to work are always welcome.
oh. you guys.
if you ever learn to spell my name correctly, i'll be filled with as much pride as this letter was supposed to fill me with.
and to quote today's PVP... "we out, bitches."
edit: cripes 1989 posts. that's a lot. who will get the infamous post #2000? will be colonel mustard? or perhaps the emo boy from final fantasy XII? stay tuned.
erucsbo
Explorer
jim pinto said:oh. you guys.
if you ever learn to spell my name correctly, i'll be filled with as much pride as this letter was supposed to fill me with.
It has to be all the same case?
You are "jim pinto" on these boards and inside WLD, and "JIM PINTO" on your blog and on the front cover of WLD.
Ah - it's a reversible spell!
Summon jim pinto, or SUMMON JIM PINTO gets the happy helpful variant, while the Summon Jim Pinto, or SuMMoN JiM PiNTo version causes a wormhole to open to an alternate dimension where an identical looking but evil version of jim waits to escape from a world of impossible publishing deadlines and overly sensitive writers with connections to the Russian Mafia.
Hussar
Legend
Now I feel bad. Jim, I most certainly didn't mean to widdle in your corn flakes. Been having a bit of a bad run with D to be honest and needed to vent. D is a fantastic region. I think it's because I went through H, K and J and those three regions are very tight. Very few errors. It's been months since I've gotten tripped up by the adventure. Added to that, I haven't had the the time or energy to do a proper job knocking up the region for play and minor glitches get amplified.
D's turning out to be an interesting region. To be honest, this is the first time I've had PC's of these levels and I'm pretty shocked how powerful the group is. They just sauntered into the formian lair, took one look, and let the cleric and wizzie incinerate everything. Good grief. A pair of blade barriers and a wall of fire and wall of force later and pretty much everything died before it had a chance to move. I had changed the mooks into mobs from DMG 2, but, that didn't matter a whole lot.
Honestly, I'm a little worried about this. I can really see the party continuing to do this. Walking into the larger areas and just unloading the kitchen sink on everything. Since the majority of the critters are pretty small, even the xill are around 35 hp, I'm not sure but it shouldn't take them too long to kill everything before it can even react.
Will have to give it some thought.
OTOH. I am one of the few that thinks Region A is pretty good. Sure, it's a bit on the repetitive side, but, there's just so many ways the region can fall out. A group that even the slightest bit interested in talking should be able to find all sorts of allies and whatnot to talk to. With a bit of work - switching out some of the darkmantle mobs - I think A could be a heck of a lot of fun. I know that it was pretty high on the popularity list for my bunch.
IMNSHO, if I ever ran the WLD again, I would use the World Serpent Inn from Dragon 351 to tie together all the regions. Each exit of a region would take you into the Inn which would allow you to rest, recover and whatnot between regions. The Inn would also have about 100 doors inside that would open into random points within the Dungeon; some one way, some only opening at certain times, that sort of thing. The main door would just send you back to where ever you had entered from.
I think this would work. Honestly, the whole, "you can only carry what you find" bit of the WLD was a weakness IMO. I think allowing a feature where the players can get stuff crafted would help to give the players a bit more feeling of control over their PC's. Also, the Inn could work as a nice source of information and rumours as well as some spell help and whatnot. Wizards could get spells for their spellbooks, diseases could get removed, PC's raised, that sort of thing.
What do you guys think?
D's turning out to be an interesting region. To be honest, this is the first time I've had PC's of these levels and I'm pretty shocked how powerful the group is. They just sauntered into the formian lair, took one look, and let the cleric and wizzie incinerate everything. Good grief. A pair of blade barriers and a wall of fire and wall of force later and pretty much everything died before it had a chance to move. I had changed the mooks into mobs from DMG 2, but, that didn't matter a whole lot.
Honestly, I'm a little worried about this. I can really see the party continuing to do this. Walking into the larger areas and just unloading the kitchen sink on everything. Since the majority of the critters are pretty small, even the xill are around 35 hp, I'm not sure but it shouldn't take them too long to kill everything before it can even react.
Will have to give it some thought.
OTOH. I am one of the few that thinks Region A is pretty good. Sure, it's a bit on the repetitive side, but, there's just so many ways the region can fall out. A group that even the slightest bit interested in talking should be able to find all sorts of allies and whatnot to talk to. With a bit of work - switching out some of the darkmantle mobs - I think A could be a heck of a lot of fun. I know that it was pretty high on the popularity list for my bunch.
IMNSHO, if I ever ran the WLD again, I would use the World Serpent Inn from Dragon 351 to tie together all the regions. Each exit of a region would take you into the Inn which would allow you to rest, recover and whatnot between regions. The Inn would also have about 100 doors inside that would open into random points within the Dungeon; some one way, some only opening at certain times, that sort of thing. The main door would just send you back to where ever you had entered from.
I think this would work. Honestly, the whole, "you can only carry what you find" bit of the WLD was a weakness IMO. I think allowing a feature where the players can get stuff crafted would help to give the players a bit more feeling of control over their PC's. Also, the Inn could work as a nice source of information and rumours as well as some spell help and whatnot. Wizards could get spells for their spellbooks, diseases could get removed, PC's raised, that sort of thing.
What do you guys think?
Ogg
First Post
!!
Well...
On characters scaling remember you have 2 factors on your side:
1) Surprise: Monsters that are prepped can be a major difference.
Are you having the players walk into a room full of monsters. Everyone roll initiative.
Or
As you enter the room you suddenly see eyes peer out at you from around rocks. You've been making enough noise to raise the dead walking around & it appears they heard you coming from a mile away. Your hit by a volley of arrows, javelins, etc.
Have smart monsters can hold fire until they see someone casting. Nothing can change spell as having to make a concentration check modified by damage. It can quickly turn into an impossible roll for even the highest level casters.
And we won't even go into flat footed AC & monsters with levels in rogue.
2)Resistances
Do players keep using the same tactic? Shouldn't word get around. Imagine what happens the first tiem they let loose with firely blast and all the monsters seem to have shimmering blue auras that repel most of the damage.
Another trick is to put in magic dead zones into areas with monsters that rely on no magic. Remember it's a prison. It's not unrealistic that areas might be covered with wards against magic. Or have dead magic pockets in the same room. You could allow a rogue to learn to find these areas & act as a spotter for the casters. Make players have to use even more tactics & less spray & pray.
---------------------
In my world they players have encountered an alter (I stuck it in the empty spot behind the 3 big pillar rooms) of a god that allows them to convert treasure into magic items to take the place of an inn or shop.
Basically they're allowed rolls on tables they can ask for but must donate a certain amount of treasure based on a prayer roll. Only issue is any roll on the lower side demands even more money & sucks experience from the player while a high roll throws in bonus stuff.
I posted the altar on another board
Altar of Sacrifice
but have already changed it somewhat to make it less mean but the first 2 "prayer rolls" at it have been a 1 & a 11
Been rough at the old prayer alter. I kind of metagamed & let the players know this was an add on to take the place of a shop so they didn't obsess on it too much.
I also threw in this artifact which they were given to start:
*Manual of the Tutor: Miscellaneous Magic Item. Has 8 uses to train anyone in any class or prestige class after 1d6+1 days of studying. After it is used 8 times the Manual Crumbles to dust.
Well...
On characters scaling remember you have 2 factors on your side:
1) Surprise: Monsters that are prepped can be a major difference.
Are you having the players walk into a room full of monsters. Everyone roll initiative.
Or
As you enter the room you suddenly see eyes peer out at you from around rocks. You've been making enough noise to raise the dead walking around & it appears they heard you coming from a mile away. Your hit by a volley of arrows, javelins, etc.
Have smart monsters can hold fire until they see someone casting. Nothing can change spell as having to make a concentration check modified by damage. It can quickly turn into an impossible roll for even the highest level casters.
And we won't even go into flat footed AC & monsters with levels in rogue.
2)Resistances
Do players keep using the same tactic? Shouldn't word get around. Imagine what happens the first tiem they let loose with firely blast and all the monsters seem to have shimmering blue auras that repel most of the damage.
Another trick is to put in magic dead zones into areas with monsters that rely on no magic. Remember it's a prison. It's not unrealistic that areas might be covered with wards against magic. Or have dead magic pockets in the same room. You could allow a rogue to learn to find these areas & act as a spotter for the casters. Make players have to use even more tactics & less spray & pray.
---------------------
In my world they players have encountered an alter (I stuck it in the empty spot behind the 3 big pillar rooms) of a god that allows them to convert treasure into magic items to take the place of an inn or shop.
Basically they're allowed rolls on tables they can ask for but must donate a certain amount of treasure based on a prayer roll. Only issue is any roll on the lower side demands even more money & sucks experience from the player while a high roll throws in bonus stuff.
I posted the altar on another board
Altar of Sacrifice
but have already changed it somewhat to make it less mean but the first 2 "prayer rolls" at it have been a 1 & a 11
Been rough at the old prayer alter. I kind of metagamed & let the players know this was an add on to take the place of a shop so they didn't obsess on it too much. I also threw in this artifact which they were given to start:
*Manual of the Tutor: Miscellaneous Magic Item. Has 8 uses to train anyone in any class or prestige class after 1d6+1 days of studying. After it is used 8 times the Manual Crumbles to dust.
Hussar
Legend
Ogg, I'm assuming you're directing that bit at me. D is a giant factory where the monsters are busily and very, very noisily digging a massive mine as well was working a foundry while they smelt silver. The players could be dragging along a calliope and not get noticed.
The issue I'm having is that 99% of the creatures in D are very low level mooks - we're talking CR 1-3 dwarves and formians for the most part with some bigger stuff added for seasoning. Against 15th level PC's, they are so much axle grease for the war machine. It doesn't matter that some have Resistance 10 - 15 die empowered fireballs kill them even if they make their saves. Or 15d8 worth of force damage from Blade Barrier.
I'm going to monkey pile them next week with most of the formians to see what happens. Then adjust tactics from there.
The issue I'm having is that 99% of the creatures in D are very low level mooks - we're talking CR 1-3 dwarves and formians for the most part with some bigger stuff added for seasoning. Against 15th level PC's, they are so much axle grease for the war machine. It doesn't matter that some have Resistance 10 - 15 die empowered fireballs kill them even if they make their saves. Or 15d8 worth of force damage from Blade Barrier.
I'm going to monkey pile them next week with most of the formians to see what happens. Then adjust tactics from there.
erucsbo
Explorer
Hussar said:
I haven't spent any time going through D (except very briefly well over a year ago), but could you somehow use the mining to destabilise the terrain?
Frequent rockfalls from the ceiling, collapsing ground underfoot, with perhaps some residual celestial magic that tries to heal the damage to the structural integrity of the rock/stone (but not enough to reverse all of the mining damage).
Characters could get trapped in opening and closing crevasses, have to expend spells evading damage from falling rocks, and generally find the environment working against them.
The formians and dwarves - natural miners - would be very cognizant of these dangers and not troubled by them, even moving opponents in combat so that they can take advantage of such occurrences.
Anyway - food for thought - might not work in your game, but if it helps then use it.
New WLD Blog
Gday All,
It's finally ready...and working.
I have finally got my own web page up which includes (or at this stage is mostly) a summary of my groups WLD sessions. The address is http://home.people.net.au/~twilko/ and you are all invited to take a look.
Feedback and questions are always welcome.
Tony,
Gday All,
It's finally ready...and working.
I have finally got my own web page up which includes (or at this stage is mostly) a summary of my groups WLD sessions. The address is http://home.people.net.au/~twilko/ and you are all invited to take a look.Feedback and questions are always welcome.
Tony,
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