[WotBS] What is the name of the continent on which WotBS takes place?

[von_recklinghausen]

Is there a name for the continent/promontory that is the setting for most of the action in WotBS? I’ve looked through the player’s guide and the campaign guide, but don’t see a name beyond those of the specific countries. I’m fairly confident my players will ask, and can make something up, but wanted to check to see if I was missing something from canon first...

 

[RangerWickett]

I think I maybe used the name Trema. Not sure if that ever got into text, or if it referred to the planet or the continent.

 

[Tormyr]

If you plan on running Zeitgeist in the future, you could always call it Lanjyr. At some point in the thousands of years between the two campaigns, the continent shattered before the seals were installed.

 

[RangerWickett]

Tormyr, I'm not permitted to make the two adventure paths be canonically in the same setting, but if I could, it'd be that Northwest Ragesia is connected but a land bridge to Northeast Drakr.

Then Elfaivar would be across a small ocean from Ostalin (on the southwest coast of the WotBS continent).

The timeline would probably place the events of WotBS at around 300 AOV 1000 BOV (1500 years ago). All the legends of the Aquiline Heart would have happened shortly after the Axis Seal ritual

 

[Tormyr]

Scribbles notes for Zeitgeist campaign in the future.

 

[Lylandra]

After having played through much of Zeitgeist and being a GM for WotBS, I'd say that you'd need to alter quite a bit of WotBS lore and setting to make it a seamless transition.

First and foremost... there was no freaking sun before the Axis Seal. So if the ritual happened shortly before WotBS, then people would have had knowledge about something crazy happening a 'couple of years' ago. Especially long-lived people like the Shahalesti.

Also, there should be mentions of planar invasions, and all the Angels/Devils in WotBS would have to be leftovers of said invasions. Summoning them would not be possible due to the 5 min restriction. Gold would block teleportation. And you'd need to decide whether or not the elemental spirits were embodiments of planes (planar avatars of some sort) or just another kind of Titan.

I don't say that it isn't doable, or that you should not mix these two settings. But it needs a lot of work and research to do it right and consistently.

(And yes, I might sound a bit nit-picky, but especially the later parts of Zeitgeist are a bit inconsistent and open up so many questions concerning the history and cosmology of the setting that we could write pages about them )

 

[Tormyr]

^ This is why I am thinking about a gap of a few thousand years between the two campaigns.

 

[Lylandra]

You'd still have to decide whether WotBS takes place before or after the first ritual.

If before, then there would be no sun (and honestly, I don't see any reason why people without at least low-light vision would even exist on such a planet).

If after, you'd have to consider the axis seal restrictions (gold/summoning/planar travel/bleak gate&dreaming).

Edit: Of course it all could make sense if you included yet another world-shaking event after WotBS where the planet somehow lost its sun. Which would explain why humans existed and were driven to near extinction. And why Toteth and his crew were so eager to recreate one.

 

[Tormyr]

I had not thought about the sun before, but my thinking was that things went out of whack at some point after the events of WotBS. The continent broke up; the sun disappeared; and the ritual was used to restore some sort of order.

It looks like I need to take a second look at Zeitgeist's history to make sure I am not messing something up.

 

[Morrus]

After having played through much of Zeitgeist and being a GM for WotBS, I'd say that you'd need to alter quite a bit of WotBS lore and setting to make it a seamless transition.

That's why I've never liked the idea of them being the same world. It feels like an awkward shoehorn of two puzzle pieces which don't fit together right. I prefer more of a D&D approach where they're their own campaign settings.

 

[hirou]

I made WotBS a part of my ZG campaign which happened circa 1500 B.O.V. (I think Ryan said as much in one of the previous threads on the topic) and placed the Axis Seal ritual at least a thousand years prior. This is made easier by the fact that none of my ZG players have played WotBS, so I can mine that campaign for lore, eladrin history, geography, artifacts and villains while disregarding most of the contradictions =)

The main point which I wanted to reinforce was that the history of civilization is bound to happen in circles and spirals due to Reida's influence on the world, with limited technological advancement through millenia and periodical epic-level campaigns catastrophic events, which more or less reset the situations (Axis Seal itself splitting the continent, WotBS, fall of demonocracy, fall of Srasama, ZG campaign itself). Within this paradigm, Danoran zone of dead magic is beyond the control of celestial bodies, which reinforces Jierre's special role in ZG plot and makes him a bit on par with other leaders of Ob. However, joking aside, I completely understand Morrus' position on not wanting to introduce unneeded cosmological complications, there's enough of them in ZG already.

 

[Lylandra]

I agree that it is much easier to implement the events of WotBS into the ZG timeline if you don't plan to play WotBS.

 

[RangerWickett]

If before, then there would be no sun (and honestly, I don't see any reason why people without at least low-light vision would even exist on such a planet).

The home game canon is that the planet was born in a sort of nebula that glowed brightly enough to support life. The place was sort of a garden/Limbo, where the rules of reality were in flux, and invaders wanted to plunder resources. Toteth was an admirer of darkness, and wanted it to crop up more often, and as they'd explored the multiverse he and his allies had seen worlds with suns, so instead of recreating the nebula thing when they did the Axis Seal, they created a system with a sun.

You got planets, and there were elemental spirits from Jiese, Avilona, Mavisha, and Urim manifesting in the Waking world. The dragon Jiese nearly killed the eagle Avilona, then hid the heart.

Civilization was in the Stone Age, and Lanjyr was particularly chaotic, since most of the invaders had been there. In 1200 BOV Kelland subdues the fey titans.

Around that time across the sea, folks have reached Bronze Age technology (Honestly, I wanted WotBS to be more Mesopotamia-inspired, but I didn't push that for the AP). The Torch gets created around 1120 BOV, and its powerful planar magic lets extraplanar creatures who are summoned around it stick around despite the Axis Seal. Some of them head west and start conquering the areas that are now northern Lanjyr. Then around 1000 BOV, we have WotBS, which ends with Leska and the Torch get buried at the Heart of History under tons of rocks. They're both technically still around, waiting for someone to dig them out.

About 500 years later (500 BOV), tech level advances to early Iron Age. Triegenes thwomps the Demonocracy. Meanwhile, who knows what's going on over to the east.

Tech level advances to roughly high Middle Ages (algebra, chemistry, large cathedrals). The two Victories happen, and then the Great Malice (1 AOV). Meanwhile, who knows what's going on over to the east.

Tech level advances to early-Renaissance in most of Lanjyr (300 AOV). In Danor, active research into technology and industry is promoted so the nation can compete against other nations with magic. By 400 AOV Danor has early steam-assisted ships, and by 460 it has full-on steam frigates. By 500 Danor and Risur both have armored steam warships.

Meanwhile, who knows what's going on over to the east.

 

[Lylandra]

Okay, now that makes a lot more sense

Using Bronze Age tech for WotBS would have been quite unique as well.

Even if you'd have to adjust the story of Toteth Topec in Shelter from the Storm so that it makes him more of a wayfarer. And I'd probably link the Gidim and the Trillith somehow. Which also could explain why the Torch, created by a psionic entity and an angelic and hellish "leftover", could actually bypass the planar disintegration barrier.

The only question you'd need to answer somehow (and this was quite hard for me in WotBS as well) is "what the eff is going on with the 'elemental plane of fire'" regarding the Burning Sky effect. Is it linked to Jiese? Is there a separate elemental plane from which Jiese was cut out? Does the rift touch this "classic plane"? And what about the Astral? Does that plane even exist? Is it (linked to) Apet?

(And also: does Gradiax know about the other continent? Did he know Syana? Is he the missing father of Trilla?)

 

[Mrpereira]

I decided that WOTBS happened in the same world, but the other side of the world. In my campaign I havemade it clear that technology back then was not very advanced, and that their writing were more like hieroglyphs than real text: Sure to those who lived at that time, it might seem very advanced, both writing and tech, but to us modern people, not so much.

As to some of the other inconsistencies: Well, since their writing left much to imagination and interpretation, a lot is explained as translation errors and misunderstandings.

The WOTBS campaing doesn't play a big role, but the occasional nod to the story like the Coaltongue just make the players smile a bit - they like that they feel they know a bit about the world they play in.