D&D 5E WotC Explains 'Canon' In More Detail

Recently, WotC's Jeremy Crawford indicated that only the D&D 5th Edition books were canonical for the roleplaying game. In a new blog article, Chris Perkins goes into more detail about how that works, and why. This boils down to a few points: Each edition of D&D has its own canon, as does each video game, novel series, or comic book line. The goal is to ensure players don't feel they have to...

Status
Not open for further replies.
Recently, WotC's Jeremy Crawford indicated that only the D&D 5th Edition books were canonical for the roleplaying game. In a new blog article, Chris Perkins goes into more detail about how that works, and why.

This boils down to a few points:
  • Each edition of D&D has its own canon, as does each video game, novel series, or comic book line.
  • The goal is to ensure players don't feel they have to do research of 50 years of canon in order to play.
  • It's about remaining consistent.

If you’re not sure what else is canonical in fifth edition, let me give you a quick primer. Strahd von Zarovich canonically sleeps in a coffin (as vampires do), Menzoberranzan is canonically a subterranean drow city under Lolth’s sway (as it has always been), and Zariel is canonically the archduke of Avernus (at least for now). Conversely, anything that transpires during an Acquisitions Incorporated live game is not canonical in fifth edition because we treat it the same as any other home game (even when members of the D&D Studio are involved).


canon.png


 

log in or register to remove this ad

Mirtek

Hero
The legends of the exploits of the Bladedancers will include the rare ability to use sword and spell together. That's lore. Lore that didn't exist before Tasha's.
Actually that's very much the exact lore about Bladedancers. You'll find no legends of exploits that tells anything different, certainly not that "and after he dealt the demon a mighty blow he waited 6 seconds to finish it with a spell"

The lore always had them weaving their blades and spells together, how this was represented in the current edition of the rules never made any difference
 

log in or register to remove this ad


Faolyn

(she/her)
Sorry, English isn't my first language and although I usually have no problems with it I don't have a clue what you want to say - and I think it's bad form to write "read section a to you see why you're wrong instead of writing "because x and y you are wrong". Maybe I am wrong but I don't know why - please explain.
The short of it is, there's almost nothing in that entry that points to gold dragons being lawful good. They eat treasure, especially if it's treasure given as a gift, but not if it's treasure given as a bribe. I wonder how they tell the difference? If you offer it nummy gemstones on its birthday? They're willing to befriend humanoids when shapechanged into humanoid form--but they "amuse themselves" by "by observing how the smaller races live." Which sounds a rather patronizing to me, because those smaller races are intelligent people, not animals you've decided to watch and anthropomorphize.

In the "Persistence of Memory" section, it says that metallic dragons can effectively smell bloodlines and will judge you based on how it interacted with your ancestors (if it knew them). The text even talks about how this isn't useful, since the metallic dragon will welcome a bad person who had good ancestor but will dislike a good person because they had a bad ancestor. Which is both bizarrely naïve and not very good of these good-aligned beings (sins of the father and whatnot). I assume that the dragons will change their mind if they learn that you're not like your great granma, although the text doesn't say.

If you're right and I did ignore the lore of Gold Dragons: The dragon was an example, please pick some other "monster" where the alignment suits the lore.
Do you mean where the alignment doesn't suit the lore? I've got some doors to trap so I don't want to spend too much time on this, but: Elves are considered good even though they are also described as at least a bit racist and they tried to genocide the quaggoths for land. Slaadi are supposed to be chaotic neutral but are continually written as being evil. Beholders are paranoid, hateful, destructive, and alien-minded, but are written as lawful. Djinni are chaotic good slavers. In 3e, dryads were chaotic good despite their whole shtick being about magically controlling and possibly raping men.

Where alignment suits the lore, the lore is often there to support the alignment even if it makes no sense on its own. Why are ettercaps evil? Dunno; ask Tolkien. Maybe he didn't like spiders? How do you know that ettercaps are evil? Because their forest homes are filled with spiders and cobwebs (so are lots of basements and garages, but never mind). So why are their forest homes filled with spiders and cobwebs? Because they're evil. Sure, ettercaps might eat people, but so do lots of unaligned animals in D&D, and while ettercaps might be more intelligent than a wolf, they still can't speak or understand any language so you can't communicate with them enough to help them learn.

Why are goblins evil? Out-of-game, it's because D&D needed low-level monsters that good PCs could kill without having their alignment change (especially back in the days when changing your alignment caused massive XP loss) and/or so the PCs don't have to feel bad about it; in game, it's currently because Maglubiyet makes them evil (by... yelling at them until they do evil?). Why does Maglubiyet want them to be evil? So that D&D has a low-level monster that PCs can kill without feeling bad about it.

The point is: Alignment for a individual person is individual (of course), declaring a default alignment for a group allows persons/monsters to be way beyond the expectation of the players. It's a valuable tool for storytelling.
In real life (with the "neutral good" humans) we are shocked by murders and other crimes because it isn't the norm. Our society rewards "good behavior" and "following the rules", most of the people do it (more or less - to a certain point) and we expect it - so (IMHO to a lesser degree) extremely alturistic or antisocial egoistic behavior are the "Hey, look at this!" exception. (So in crime novels the point is not always the "How" and the "Who", it's the "Why").
So the real question is, why isn't the neutral or neutral good the default alignment for every intelligent being, or at least every intelligent and social mortal creature? I can see creatures with supernatural origins having a different default alignment (meaning aberrations, celestials, constructs, elementals, fey, fiends, and undead), since they don't have anything like real-world biology or a mortal mindset. And I can see extremely solitary beings like dragons having different default alignments. But intelligent and social beings? Why aren't all orcs, goblins, ogres, giants, etc. neutral good by default?

There would still be plenty of exceptions to that default. As you say, "neutral good" humans are shocked by murders and crimes, which means that there are still people committing those evil acts. And there would be other evil acts as well simply owing to the magical nature of the universe, like creating undead, stealing souls, opening gateways to fell dimensions and allowing demons in, etc.
 

LazarusKane

Explorer
And the other gods just let him have those?
Sure - who want's people who will complain the whole time because they are salty that even in death some "gods" claim them :p

I'm not even sure that there will be no Forgotten Realms atheists who demand "The Wall" they heard about all their life.

PS: Stating the - hopefully- obvious: No, I don't want to mock atheists, I mock people in general.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
The wall isnt terrible at all. Its an eventual oblivion.

Would you not rather a resource be available to you later, than never?
For starters, the actual description of the wall marks it as pretty terrible. It's punishment, after all, and some descriptions say it's a slow, agonizing dissolution. The Neverwinter Nights 2 wiki calls it "suffering and eventual oblivion." Condemning someone to suffer is terrible, especially if it's for something as minor as not believing in a god.

Secondly, saying living people are a "resource" once again paints these gods in a very negative light.

Thirdly, you yourself said that you think the gods would rather people go evil then become part of the wall.
 
Last edited:

Faolyn

(she/her)
Regarding the beauty thing, I feel like you dodged the question. Just because, for instance, I use an adventure where the BBEGs are hags and the Good aligned, friendly npc is a nymph doesn't mean that I believe beautiful = good. Heck, I can present multiple conflicting belief systems without believing in any of them.
I didn't dodge the question, and what goes on in your game is not the same as what's written in the actual books.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
Then I expect you to ask them to remove all bad stuff, since it's all "toxic."
Sigh.

Some things are supposed to be bad so the players can fix them. Evil bandits, cultists, slavers, or invading army? The PCs can kill them, drive them off, or bring them to justice. Evil ruler or ruler-behind-the-throne? The PCs can kill or expose them. Evil monster devouring children out of their bed? The PCs can kill them or break their power.

The Wall and things like the way drow or the Vistani are/used to be presented aren't things the PCs can fix. They're setting elements you're supposed to accept just because they're setting elements, even if they're really toxic. These are things that the writers need to fix.

There is zero reason why there needs to be a WotF in the first place, especially when it's far more sensible to say that atheist souls just vanish into oblivion.
 

J.Quondam

CR 1/8
There is zero reason why there needs to be a WotF in the first place, especially when it's far more sensible to say that atheist souls just vanish into oblivion.
Looking at similar threads on this topic from the last couple years, it sounds like this Wall been effectively deleted/errata'd away, and so basically falls under WotC's blanket "old stuff may be objectionable" disclaimer.
Is that not correct? Is it still an active bit of official lore?

(Despite my previously stated views on this subject, this is a serious question fro someone not conversant in FR lore.)
 


Faolyn

(she/her)
Looking at similar threads on this topic from the last couple years, it sounds like this Wall been effectively deleted/errata'd away, and so basically falls under WotC's blanket "old stuff may be objectionable" disclaimer.
Is that not correct? Is it still an active bit of official lore?

(Despite my previously stated views on this subject, this is a serious question fro someone not conversant in FR lore.)
It's been errata'd out of SCAG. Presumably this means its no longer any sort of canon.
 

Status
Not open for further replies.
Remove ads

Remove ads

Top