WOTC is out of their freakin minds...

[jeffh]

Emailing from New Zealand, Even at full price it would be cheaper to get that PDF than buy and have It posted half way around the world.

Wow. I've heard lots of people make the argument Mouseferatu made, but this is actually the first time I've heard someone chime in actually claiming to be one of the people they talk about.

Having said that, I'm surprised to hear this from someone in a country like New Zealand. I would think you could easily get WotC books locally there. It's not like it's Swaziland or something.

Even if that's difficult for some unfathomable-to-me reason, what's stopping you from getting it on eBay? Most sellers will ship worldwide.

 

[MerricB]

In Australia, Frostburn sells for about aus$60. At the current rate of exchange, that's somewhere about us$42.

You know, the cost of that PDF is looking pretty good.

Cheers!

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

Even if that's difficult for some unfathomable-to-me reason, what's stopping you from getting it on eBay? Most sellers will ship worldwide.

Because even if you get it on eBay, you still most likely are buying it from someone on the other side of the planet from NZ. Shipping charges still add up no matter if you buy it from WotC or an eBay seller.


Regards,
Eric Anondson

 

[Nightfall]

As for why it's not cracked the top 10...probably because both Beyond Countless Doors and Mystic Secrets are REALLY great books.

 

[xazil]

In Australia, Frostburn sells for about aus$60. At the current rate of exchange, that's somewhere about us$42.

You know, the cost of that PDF is looking pretty good.

Cheers!

If you use Military Simulations in Melbourne (www.milsims.com.au) try talking to them about the price when that happens. I've had good luck getting the price down closer to even comparing our prices to US prices. Also it's pretty easy to get 10% off their normal prices all the time if you deal with them a bit.

Disclaimer: I have no FLGS and don't work for MilSims, just a happy customer.

 

[MerricB]

Actually, I got my copy of Frostburn for aus$50, because I have an extremely good FLGS which discounts the books normally and then discounts them more for me because I'm such a good customer.

However, I rather think my experience isn't typical.

In Australia, the price of the PDF is on the borderline that might make it worth it - there are probably places that make it definitely worth it.

Indeed, for a book like Frostburn, where you don't need most of it sitting beside you all the time, a PDF may be adequate.

Cheers!

 

[Alzrius]

But still, I believe if there are some products available, it's WotC's. Plus, if they'd simply have these people as target audience, I think the audience for that product would be miniscule compared to the possibly interested people. If you can't get D&D books around your home, chances are you turn to another RPG, if possible, or don't even learn about D&D.

That doesn't really strike me as true at all.

For one thing, just because you'd have some RPG books in a remote location doesn't mean you'll have the latest releases of anything. When I was in Japan, I was able to find exactly one store that sold d20 material. A significant portion of it was WotC, but I still didn't see anything newer than three months previous. For people who want the book now, PDF is often the way to go.

Likewise, just because WotC books (theoretically) make up the bulk of the books available in some remote location doesn't mean they'll have all of them. Selling out is a real possibility if the store doesn't purchase too many.

Finally, the idea that WotC's books are the easiest to acquire is reversed in terms of PDFs. If you have more PDF's than hard copies because it's expensive to buy the physical books where you are, then WotC books are a rarity. It's not like there are places to legally download the MMIII or the Eberron Campaign Setting.

While it may not have been their intent, I think WotC is making a smart move releasing it now in a PDF format. The idea that it's for the same price is probably a shrewder move than I see them getting credit for. The people who would buy the book anyway will still do so, and the people who prefer PDF to hard copy (for whatever reason), now can also buy it, at the same price (which means no loss of revenue for WotC). In short, they have something to gain, and virtually nothing to lose. I think we'll be seeing more of this in the future.

 

[BSF]

I imagine WotC is taking the same approach that Fantasy Flight Games is. When DTRPG first hit the market, I posted an open letter asking a few questions. There is a lot there, so let me quote the portions relevant to this thread.

I understand that the digital market is not your primary market, but I am curious on what the target customer for each publisher is. My observation is that I am not the target customer for many of these publishers. Some of the printed books are available to me at lower prices than the digital version. Perhaps the target customer is somebody that does not have ready access to print copies?

That is, at least, the case for FFG. Even so, we'd like to price our eBooks at a more competitive price--obviously, we'd like to produce as much revenue from this venture as possible. However, many of our retailers and distributors are extremely concerned (and every bit as passionate as many here) about direct-to-consumer competition from publishers. These folks are extremely important to us. Consider: The vast majority of FFG's revenues do not even derive from RPG products, let alone eBook versions of those products. It would be the height of insanity for us, as a company, to jeopardize even one relationship with a retailer or distributor over the pricing of RPG eBooks. We may all believe that eBooks and print products don't compete with each other, but frankly, it isn't our perception that matters here. It's theirs, and we're going to respect that. If that means we sell fewer eBooks than we otherwise would, that's unfortunate for both the company and the customers we might otherwise have gained, but we'll have to live with it. For now.

Thanks much,

Greg
FFG

I applaud WotC's entry into the market. I am still not happy with DRM (Since one of my computers is a Linux laptop) so I won't be purchasing a product that is not supported on the machine that is increasingly my game prep tool. But that is OK I guess since I am not perceived to be the target market. As many people have already posted, there is a market for the full price/near full price PDFs among folks that have difficulty obtaining a cost effective print copy. Publishers are testing the waters. I keep buying PDFs over at RPGNow and I am barely giving DTRPG a look. It's too bad those vendors aren't able to appeal to me, but at least they are evaluating electronic formats. In the long term, it will strengthen the market. We are at the beginning of this journey and there are bound to be bumps as the industry evaluates all the options.

 

[ayrwind]

Just to add to the statistics.

Here in Singapore, my FLGS got Frostburn 2 weeks after US release. It is sold for S$73, which is around $43 US.

In Singapore, we are used to having books late, and paying more than what the US people are paying for their books. These 2 are valid reasons for people here to choose pdf over print.

Also, our FLGS do not bring in every book released. Only the big titles. If we want other books, we have to ask the FLGS to make a special order. And this places us at the whim and fancy of the US distributors that ship books to Singapore.

For the record, I ordered Paranoia XP way before it was released, and my kind FLGS placed the ordered months ago. To date, the distributor kept saying no stock, and I have yet to receive my book.

If I chose pdf, I would have already been playing a Paranoia campaign by now.

Hope this sheds more like on the constraints we gamers face halfway around the globe.

 

[SSquirrel]

also, wotc have the liberty to charge watever they want for the books. yes, a pdf is cheaper to produce than print books, and is not something physical, but then, a majority of the $34.95 US that i pay is *not* for the cost of printing and binding the book. the majority is as payment for the people who wrote the book (besides lining the wallets of hasbro executives ).

I'll take "Lining Hasbro Executives Pockets for $600 Alex!". Developers, etc (in general) haven't gotten royalties for stuff in years. Now it's standardly a set fee after publishing. Better you are the more you make and occasional bonuses for high sales etc, but by and large you aren't paying for the writers to get more money. They already made most everything they're going to make from the book.

Of course, someone from the industry will probably say they pay royalties now that I've said this, but oh well *grin*

Hagen