log in or register to remove this ad

 

D&D 5E WotC Ranger: Drakewarden released at D&D Celebration


log in or register to remove this ad

Yeah. I see no problem with the class as is. Maybe they wanted small and medium sized rangers to gain the same powers... But then medium size is often an advantage to begin with.
But really the power level of the ranger is ok. Maybe making the bite magical at level 7 would be a good idea. Or dod I miss something?
 

Ath-kethin

Elder Thing
You mean like releasing a PC race that can fly from 1st level...three days ago. But flight being too much before 15th level a few weeks from now.
To my mind, what you describe is more of an oversight issue than a vision one. Odds are that two different teams, at two different times, developed the two concepts independently, and under two different time frames and arcs. And no one cross referenced them before they were published.
 

They put various races at a disadvantage all the time. Sometimes based on size.
I'm more referring to that this is a class feature that's meant to apply broadly across any race. The suggestions have been to set up the class such that if you happen to pick a small race, you'll effectively have a whole other feature from this class that a character with a medium sized race will not have. If there is to be flight as a class feature, any PC who has this class needs to have access to it equally, which is what the current configuration of the class does, regardless of whether the level at which it is accessed is useful.
 

Dollars to donuts, this is the reason. Access to flight at 7th level is perfectly reasonable - Wizards can learn the fly spell by then. However, they don’t want you having a Large companion that early, and they’re probably worried that a Medium sized creature flying on a Medium sized mount would strain suspension of disbelief. So, Medium characters get to ride it at 7th but can’t fly on it until 15th. And since they don’t want Small characters to make objectively better Drakewardens than Medium ones, neither can Small characters.

Not saying it’s a good decision, but I’m positive that’s the logic behind it.
Whew! I thought maybe I didn't communicate my point well enough!
 

From a balance perspective... I mean, the twilight cleric gets concentration-less flight at level 6 so... let small rangers ride their drake!!
What about the angle of the party now having a steed that realistically anybody in the party could mount and ride since it's trained and it's friendly? Maybe they felt that was too much of a boon earlier in the game? If your fairy or aarakocra character can fly, that's just them. It's never going to apply to anyone else in the party. If you're a Twilight cleric you can fly early. Again, just you. Magic items allow you to fly as well, but a DM can easily just not ever drop those items if they don't want you flying early. Just spitballing thoughts here... :)
 

Jmarso

Adventurer
"While you are riding your drake, it can’t use the flying speed of this feature."

So...you don't get to do literally the one thing you'd want to do with a pet dragon. Wow. That's...uh...something.

ETA: 15th level you can ride your flying drake. Fairies and aarakocra can fly from 1st level, but you have to wait until 15th for a dragon to carry you while flying. Yikes.
One of the first things that'll get house ruled away, I expect. ;)
 


Laurefindel

Legend
"While you are riding your drake, it can’t use the flying speed of this feature."

So...you don't get to do literally the one thing you'd want to do with a pet dragon. Wow. That's...uh...something.

ETA: 15th level you can ride your flying drake. Fairies and aarakocra can fly from 1st level, but you have to wait until 15th for a dragon to carry you while flying. Yikes.
it's a bit of a let down, but at least it keeps the drake companion in line with the beasts of the beastmaster
 


And Druids can wildshape into a flying creature at level 8. Seriously, they should be able to ride their flying drake at level 7!
That seems a bit early to me. If you wildshape into a flying creature you’re kinda stuck doing just the stuff that creature can do. On the other hand, if you’re riding on the back of your cool dragon buddy your dragon buddy can do a bunch of stuff while flying around and you also get to do a bunch of stuff yourself. I mean sure you need to spend a bonus action to command it, but most wild shapable (?) beasts don’t have bonus actions anyway.
 

AcererakTriple6

Autistic DM (he/him)
That seems a bit early to me. If you wildshape into a flying creature you’re kinda stuck doing just the stuff that creature can do. On the other hand, if you’re riding on the back of your cool dragon buddy your dragon buddy can do a bunch of stuff while flying around and you also get to do a bunch of stuff yourself. I mean sure you need to spend a bonus action to command it, but most wild shapable (?) beasts don’t have bonus actions anyway.
Twilight Clerics can fly for free at level 6, Druids can do it at level 8, quite a few races can do it at either level 1 or 3, and I could go on.

There are good wildshapes that can fly (Quetzalcoatlus, for example). It doesn't matter if they have bonus action options or not. They can fly, and can do so for several hours straight, and without needing to concentrate. A Ranger that has a pet dragon would not be broken if it was allowed to ride their flying dragon at level 7.
 

Actually rereading the subclass I’m seeing that others wouldn’t be able to ride around on it like a flying carpet since they’d still be too big until 15th level, but the concept of you being able to ride a Medium creature is even weirder to me.

I definitely wouldn’t go with a flying mount until at least 11th level, and the current 15th level works in two ways: it’s the capstone of an interesting conceptual progression/evolution of a draconic companion who grows and becomes more powerful as you do; it also kinda aligns with the paladin not getting Find Greater Steed to have a flying mount until 13th level.

Also, if you already get a flying dragon mount at 7th level, how do you even follow that up in the subclass? What’s the progression after that? The 11th level feature and the 15th level feature without the flight are themselves pretty unimpressive once you’re already a dragon rider. Getting a flying dragon BFF feels very much like a capstone feature.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Also, if you already get a flying dragon mount at 7th level, how do you even follow that up in the subclass? What’s the progression after that? The 11th level feature and the 15th level feature without the flight are themselves pretty unimpressive once you’re already a dragon rider. Getting a flying dragon BFF feels very much like a capstone feature.
Faster flying speed. More maneuverability. More damage. More hit points. Bigger breath weapon. Special actions from the dragon type. Trick riding stunts. Taking passengers. Bonus actions. Reactions. Not needing to be commanded to perform actions. Synergies with the rider and mount. Shared senses. There's lots of things you could do.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
So anyone know how much the drake weighs? If the damned thing can't carry the drakewarden until 15th level, maybe a drakewarden with a sufficient strength could carry it. Use one of those magic items that grant flying and carry it around while you fly. Or play a fairy drakewarden with high strength and tote it around like a pokemon until it's useful.
 

Faster flying speed. More maneuverability. More damage. More hit points. Bigger breath weapon. Special actions from the dragon type. Trick riding stunts. Taking passengers. Bonus actions. Reactions. Not needing to be commanded to perform actions. Synergies with the rider and mount. Shared senses. There's lots of things you could do.
In which case it becomes much harder to argue that it's still balanced, and the concept becomes much less interesting. I personally like hatching a Charmander and then evolving it into a Charizard as I explore the Kanto region. It wouldn't be as interesting if the final evolution came much sooner because after that it's really just increasing those attack and defense stats, which is much less fun. I like the concept of what they're doing here as is, although I don't disagree that there could be improvements. In my view, if you want to ride around on a smaller dragon at 7th level, that would be more of a "befriend a young dragon and turn it into a sidekick" deal than something codified in a subclass.
 

AcererakTriple6

Autistic DM (he/him)
Actually rereading the subclass I’m seeing that others wouldn’t be able to ride around on it like a flying carpet since they’d still be too big until 15th level,
As currently written, a Small creature could ride your flying drake, but you couldn't, at level 7. So, at level 7 two Small drakewardens (Small Harengon, Fairies, Goblins, Kobolds, etc) could summon their medium drakes that can fly, and switch with each other to be able to ride a drake and fly at that level.

So, yes, other people could ride your flying drake at level 7, so long as they're small.

It's just weirdly written, and it gating you from doing the one thing you're known for for no apparent reason.
but the concept of you being able to ride a Medium creature is even weirder to me.
In Icewind Dale: Rime of the Frostmaiden, there's an encounter that is with a Frost Giant (which are Huge) that's mounted on a Mammoth (which is also Huge). This breaks the PHB's rules for mounting, but it's not a big deal, because it's cool.
I definitely wouldn’t go with a flying mount until at least 11th level, and the current 15th level works in two ways: it’s the capstone of an interesting conceptual progression/evolution of a draconic companion who grows and becomes more powerful as you do; it also kinda aligns with the paladin not getting Find Greater Steed to have a flying mount until 13th level.
Here's the thing; those aren't for balance reasons. I don't see any reason why having a flying mount at level 7 for a subclass feature would be mechanically broken. There's clearly more broken things that certain subclasses get access to (again, Twilight Cleric comes to mind, or the Echo Knight being able to summon levitating echoes that can pick them up and move them wherever they want at level 3).
Also, if you already get a flying dragon mount at 7th level, how do you even follow that up in the subclass? What’s the progression after that? The 11th level feature and the 15th level feature without the flight are themselves pretty unimpressive once you’re already a dragon rider. Getting a flying dragon BFF feels very much like a capstone feature.
Uh, by having the drake deal more damage, get access to breath weapons, more movement speeds, magical damage, blindsight (because it is a dragon), an ability to heal itself using its hit dice, or similar abilities. You can easily give impressive capstones and have the subclass be balanced while letting a Dragon Rider ride their dragon (and fly) before late Tier 3 of the campaign.
 




Level Up!

An Advertisement

Advertisement4

Top