WotC Replies: Statements by WotC employees regarding Dragon/Dungeon going online

[Hussar]

So, what sort of content would grow D&D? New rules, new spells, new PrCs? Dragon has certainly had it's share of these. I'm not really sure I get your point. :\

New mechanics in Dragon? In the past two or three years? Not so much. Much of the content has been focused on existing PI, particularly Greyhawk in both Dungeon and Dragon. Ecology articles drawing from various monster manuals, the Adventure Paths, Class Acts, etc.

There was a time when new mechanics would regularly feature in Dragon first to test the water. I have the issue with the rules for vehicular combat in D&D that was reprinted almost verbatim in the Arms and Equipment guide. Now, you get articles that mesh nicely with existing books, but, rarely entirely new rules. Yes, sometimes you do, but not often.

I would say that the original content that WOTC produces helps to grow D&D. Building on existing content is nice, but, doesn't really help to grow things. It simply feeds what is already there.

If WOTC wants us all online, then PROVE the model with great content and varied access models. In the meantime, they should have left the "little guys" doing what they do, on behalf of their shared customers.

How? What proof would be sufficient? Say they come out with fantastic material that is every geek's dream. They pour the money in to drive a great thing forward. And in the process drill Paizo into the ground. Is that helping the industry? Or, supposing the material isn't great and everyone points to Paizo as to how it "should be done". Both are Lose Lose situations for WOTC. Even if the DI is "good enough", at what point could WOTC yank the license to Dungeon and Dragon?

How would it look for WOTC to spend advertising dollars in Dungeon and Dragon advertising online competition for both magazines. "Hey, I know you just bought this magazine, but, y'know, don't buy the next one because you can get everything in here plus more online!" Yeah, that would go over well.

Instead, by killing the print versions, the DI will be allowed to succeed or fail on its own merits.

I rather thought that WOTC was interested in promoting the industry on behalf of gamers.

How is competing with itself promoting the industry? That sort of thing sunk TSR back in the day with constant fractioning of the fan base. By allowing Dungeon and Dragon to continue, that's precisely what you are doing. Some people would only read the magazine, others would only read online.

 

[caudor]

I'll miss Dragon and Dungeon like everyone else. But call me a sucker---call me loyal.

I still have faith in our friends at WotC. Something cool is coming.

 

[Khairn]

I'll miss Dragon and Dungeon like everyone else. But call me a sucker---call me loyal.

I still have faith in our friends at WotC. Something cool is coming.

"our" friends? Okedokey, your a sucker.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

"our" friends? Okedokey, your a sucker.

Because obviously they hate D&D and everyone that plays it just beacuse they decided to cut two magazines.

So now everyone that doesn't despite WotC is a sucker? Man, I love the internet.

 

[caudor]

"our" friends? Okedokey, your a sucker.

I don't mind being called a sucker in this context, but I do find your lack of faith...disturbing

 

[Piratecat]

Devyn, AMG, and everyone else -- I'm tired, and I try not to moderate when I'm tired, so you're getting an unexpected chance. Quit the bickering snark NOW. Our tolerance for this bullcrap is close to zero, and now is not the time to push limits. Please stay away from passive aggressive sniping as well.

I hope this is exquisitely clear to all and sundry.

 

[caudor]

I guess the reason I'm optimistic is that I see certain pieces falling into place. As of now, Wotc has not renewed CMP, Paizo, and now Dragonlance.

This leads me to believe that WotC is taking their Digital Initiative *very* seriously. If this includes all or some of the goodies that have been speculated about, then we have reason to be excited. I'm talking character generator (with access to sources!), the ability to play D&D over with internet with distant friends, and online content that can be searched.

That's why I think the DI is the next big thing: it may make D&D easier to play without dumbing it down.

 

[Khairn]

Piratecat ... noted.

Caudor, I wish I could share your optimism, but I think that in the case of both Paizo and now Weis/Hickman, that both companies were doing an outstanding job and providing support for their products that was stellar.

If WotC had such constant high standards I might be willing to harbor a similarly optimistic outlook. But it doesn't. Even with Dragon, Dungeon, Dragonlance, Ravenloft and every other IP added to DI, I still fear it will be a step down.

 

[Agamon]

I'll withhold judgment until WotC actually graces its customers with tangible DI information.

And I'll go as far as to say that they have a whole lot to prove in the electronic/online department. I have no reason to think this won't flop like landbound fish. I'd like them to prove me wrong, but I kinda doubt it'll happen.

 

[Jer]

I've seen this time and time again and my question still doesn't get answered.

What benefit does WOTC get allowing Paizo to continue publishing Dragon and Dungeon if they are going to produce similar (or same) material? Considering Paizo is using WOTC's own PI to push their magazines, how would it possibly help WOTC to compete with its own licencee?

Well for starters, Dragon and Dungeon are a pre-existing network of D&D players that WotC is cutting off in one fell swoop while they create their Digital Initiative. By maintaining both the print magazine and their new digital platform simultaneously, Wizards could still maintain that player network while building their new player network. By canceling the magazines up front, Wizards cuts off that player network entirely.

Some of those folks will, of course, move to the new network. Some of them will move blindly, just trusting that Wizards will provide a good digital product. Others will wait-and-see if the new site is going to be worthwhile. But some of us probably won't bother at all, and that's one less connection to these gamers that Wizards has. As Wizards loses contact points with this group of gamers, it becomes easier for them to move to other games, move out of the hobby altogether, or, just as bad for Wizards, not bother to "upgrade" to the next version of the game when it comes out.

If WOTC, with the DI, comes to dominate the market and Dragon and Dungeon take a nosedive, then they are the big bullies screwing the little guy. If the DI fails, then, well, it's just vindication for all the WOTC detractors out there. There's simply no upside.

So, to all those out there who think that Dragon and Dungeon should be allowed to continue, please answer the following question: What benefit does WOTC get for allowing Paizo to retain the license?

I disagree with this - I agree that the ENnies are a lose-lose situation for Wizards (and therefore its a good idea that they don't submit anything and let it be an award for the rest of the market), but this is a completely different story. If the DI fails, well these online pay-for-subscription sites haven't been successful for anyone (other than the porn sites, I guess), so really there's no egg on anyone's face -- its just that the digital model (still) isn't ready for primetime yet.

OTOH, if the DI succeeds wildly and Dragon and Dungeon become unprofitable to maintain because of the competition, well it would be PAIZO who would be canceling them, not Wizards. Paizo would not renew the license, and Wizards would just say "well, magazines just don't work any more, so with a heavy heart we find that we need to cancel the magazines altogether - but hey, we're still doing stuff on-line so check us out". Paizo would be the ones taking all of the risks in this scenario, not Wizards.

Indeed, it seems like Wizards is taking an unnecessary hit in the PR department here. If they'd built their site first, had some content up for a while (say a year) and allowed word of mouth and reviews to build up BEFORE cancelling Dragon and Dungeon, people might be more comfortable with the move to the digital format. Instead, they announced it suddenly, without any forewarning, and haven't been able to show what kind of content they'll be replacing it with or how much it's going to cost.