WotC Responds!!!

[Psion]

Totally. I didn't think about that part of it til just now. Thats just icky.

I'm honestly surprised that anyone who has gamed for more than a few years could not realize it. I don't think I was gaming long when I realized that for the typical male hetero player:

1) It's not comfortable for a male player to do intimate roleplaying of a romantic encounter with a female NPC portrayed by a male DM. I have quite an imagination, but it is sort of hard to miss the hoary beard on the person whispering you sweet nothings...
2) It's much less comfortable when the male DM uses the game as a playground for his sexual fantasies when players who are getting too much information are involved. (Okay, you may have not had this fact impinge upon you personally, but trust me, it's not a comfortable situation.)
3) No matter how serious a romantic or sexual product is, hetero american males (again, a majority of the gaming populace) have grown up thinking genitalia and sex are funny topics and the results are, more often than not, going to be farcical.

 

[Enceladus]

I'm honestly surprised that anyone who has gamed for more than a few years could not realize it. I don't think I was gaming long when I realized that for the typical male hetero player:

1) It's not comfortable for a male player to do intimate roleplaying of a romantic encounter with a female NPC.
2) It's much less comfortable when the male DM uses the game as a playground for his sexual fantasies when players who are getting too much information are involved. (Okay, you may have not had this fact impinge upon you personally, but trust me, it's not a comfortable situation.)
3) No matter how serious a romantic or sexual product is, hetero american males (again, a majority of the gaming populace) have grown up thinking genitalia and sex are funny topics and the results are, more often than not, going to be farcical.

Oh, I've realized it. I just didn't put it in the context of this coversation regarding this book.

I agree with all 3. Most often (read, always) these things degenerate in rapid progress.

 

[Dreeble]

Crunchy?

Heya:

Assuming the BoEF will actually eventually come out, I wonder how successful it'll be? I mean, if I want to buy porn, er, I mean erotica, then I'll just go and buy some. If I want a useful gaming product, it doesn't really sound like this will be one. Maybe for fights against succubi, but that only happens like every third encounter, tops.

Basically, besides completists, how many people will actually buy BoEF and _use_ stuff from it in their campaigns. For example, I can picture a three-legged cat buying it, because cats are pretty open-minded, but incorporating _any_ of it into his campaign?

Take care,
Dreeble

 

[EricNoah]

Hey there, folks, some reminders and warnings for all of you:

You are not to drag religion or politics into this discussion. That will probably be hard for some of you. But don't do it. I don't want to read any more posts about the "moral minority" or "I detest Ms. Clinton" or anything like that.

You are not to make personal attacks, on each other or on the producers/authors of this project. I know this has been hard for some of you. It's hard to understand how someone can hold the exact oposite opinion to yours and still be a reasonable, thinking, worthwhile human being. But get used to it, it's the only way we're going to get along around here. I don't want to read any more comments like "you're narrow-minded" or "try discussing this in an intelligent manner" (implication: you're not doing so) or anything like that.

Suggested alternatives -- say what *you* think, what *you* feel, but don't say what *others* should think or feel, and leave the blaming, accusations and the whole "why are you people so stupid" attitude behind.

Thanks to the many posters who have attempted to participate in these emotionally-charged discussions in a very pleasant, mature manner.

 

[Squire James]

Much ado over not much. I probably wouldn't buy such a book, but I can see how others would.

Publishing an OGL isn't tantamount to saying, "We must approve of every product published under this License without reservation." At least, I didn't see anything like that in the OGL, but please correct me if I'm wrong!

WoTC didn't say a word about firing Anthony, and they didn't say a word from stopping him from what he's apparently doing. They DID say they didn't like it, though, and Anthony could very well be on thin ice. I've heard of far sillier reasons to fire someone than this. All that is WoTC's and Anthony's business, not ours.

 

[Mean DM]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Irrespective of my own opinion...

Are you in danger of losing your job because you recommended a director and the student took that recommendation and searched out the worst possible in film choices from that director?

If no then why should DnD be any different? There are thousands of DnD supplements out now. Why should ONE bad one mean so much?

Doc. I will not recommend anything to minors that has a direct like to sex. And this is linked IMO. In the case of the porn director, if I knew of his past endeavors, no, I wouldn't suggest him. I can refute the whole spell casting argument by Jack C. I can't refute a book about sex. You can chaulk up magic to realm of fantasy. But when it comes to sex, fantasy is just as bad as the realm thing in the perspective of some parents.

Another way of putting it is this. I would have *no* problems with a parent reviewing any of the current d20 books on the market. Not any longer.

But don't get me wrong. I will still recommend the d&d outside of my professional role. Just not when I am representing my school district.

Mark

 

[Enceladus]

Hey there, folks,

You know, if your new avatar is really you, you kind of look like me about 10 years and 45 pounds ago.....

 

[ColonelHardisson]

You know, if your new avatar is really you, you kind of look like me about 10 years and 45 pounds ago.....

It's actually Mike Nelson of Mystery Science Theater 3000.

 

[SemperJase]

Re: Re: Re: Re: WotC: Time to part with Mr. Valtera.

As long as a person is not doign something ILLEGAL it doesnt matter if their personal activities might or might not HELP the company they work at.

Really, this is not true. While it is legal for AV to publish this, it should still be grounds for dismissal.

Clearly AV has put himself in a conflict of interest. Contrary to what another poster said, it does NOT matter if AV does work for this company on his own time.

An executive for Coke cannot moonlight for Pepsi. The reason is, it is not possible for AV to work for the other company without using the knowledge WotC provides him. He will use his knowledge of market studies, design, and industry contacts developed at WotC in developing a product for a competing company.

WotC truly is foolish if they allow this to continue.

Imagine the marketing manager of McDonald's opening up his own hamburger stand then uses his affiliation with McDonald's to get more attention for his stand. The argument "he's doing it on his own time" does not hold water.

 

[Assenpfeffer]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: WotC: Time to part with Mr. Valtera.

Really, this is not true. While it is legal for AV to publish this, it should still be grounds for dismissal.

Clearly AV has put himself in a conflict of interest. Contrary to what another poster said, it does NOT matter if AV does work for this company on his own time.

An executive for Coke cannot moonlight for Pepsi. The reason is, it is not possible for AV to work for the other company without using the knowledge WotC provides him. He will use his knowledge of market studies, design, and industry contacts developed at WotC in developing a product for a competing company.

WotC truly is foolish if they allow this to continue.

Imagine the marketing manager of McDonald's opening up his own hamburger stand then uses his affiliation with McDonald's to get more attention for his stand. The argument "he's doing it on his own time" does not hold water.

This part of the argument is a fair point, but I disagree with the conclusion (that WotC should fire AV,) nor do I believe it to be vaild in the industry we're talking about.

The point of the OGL is to enable WotC to profit from the support created by other companies from their product. This is very different from the sort of relationship McDonalds has with Burger King, or that Coke has with Pepsi. Those companies fight for market share. The entire basis of the OGL model is that WotC already has the market share.

There's a whole list of people who've done work for Wizards, or are currently on their payroll, yet have done things with other publishers. It's the way the business model that WotC has set up works.

Nor can he be fired based on the conflict of "occult" interests with WotC's corporate image. It's flatly illegal to dismiss someone on the basis of religious affiliation, by both state and federal statute, and WotC would be opening themselves to a near-certain court defeat and seven-figure settlement if they were so foolish as to fire him for that reason.

And justifiably so. It's blatant bigotry, should be unlawful, and WotC would deserve everything they got.


EDIT: to fix a missing double negative that hosed up the whole thing I was saying.