[WOTC] Revised Corebooks for July confirmed with info

[Flexor the Mighty!]

If, in a year, when a new 3rd party book or adventure comes out and it's still totally compatable with my 3.0 books in terms of spell lists, NPC stat blocks, etc. then I'll be happy. If I have to go through them and modify a ton of crap to make it compatable with my old books I'll be pissed and done buying any new d20 stuff as I don't want to have to rework everything I buy.

If compatable means, "well the mechanics are the same, but the classes are modified in terms of feats & skill lists, and the spell have changed in levels and descriptions in some cases. It will work fine with old material if you don't mind some inconsistancies..." you can get I'll be dissapointed, and WOTC & the rest of the d20 guys will lose a customer. But until the books hit I don't think I have much to whine about.

 

[Technik4]

I'll just chip in that I will probably buy the RPHB out the gate, and will eventually get the revised other 2. When I heard about the new revision they did not-so-long-ago I decided to wait, since it didn't seem decisive enough. If everything gets added to the SRD what reason is there to complain?

I mean, maybe there will be some actual "new" feats, like feats for people with Cha 13+ or Con 13+. Maybe the whole Bluff/Diplomacy/Intimidate thing will be cleaned up (or at least give intimidate a more definitive use). Maybe Spring Attack will be understandable the first time you read the feat, ditto Attack of Opportunity.

Honestly, I couldn't be happier about this. I haven't bought a WotC book in quite some time after I finished my splatbook collection. Looks like I have something to look forward to.

Oh yeah, I love miniatures, so I can't wait to see the new rules. I was an avid Chainmail fan (and have been buying up cheap miniatures instead of new books the last few months ) and am excited both about the new line, and the new ways they will work in our games.

Technik

 

[thalmin]

They did say

These revised editions also contain bonus content, such as new feats, that are EXCLUSIVE to these new editions.

(emphasis mine)

 

[DonAdam]

My try at the guessing game:

1) Revised ranger, bard, and possibly sorc.

2) Changes to haste (and therefore possibly slow), harm, and polymorph other (self isn't the problem, other is permanent)

3) Skill focus goes to +3

4) Clarification of skills and AoO as per SWRCB

5) Comprehensive, horribly incorrect ECL's (a la Dragon Magazine)

6) The handful of good things from the 5 splatbooks and FRCS, making my money on them wasted (but at least I won't have to lug them around)

7) Better stat blocks

8) Magic item creation clarification

9) More spells from previous editions (feign death, etc)

What I want but there's no way in hell I'm going to see:

1) A generic woodsman- not all of them, to be competent, should be dual wielding spellcasting racists.

2) A unique bard (like Monte's or something like it) rather than something that just looks like a multiclassed character.

3) More generic core classes. There are several basic archetypes that can't be made. A good skill monkey without sneak attack, and a non-combative priest.

4) Nerfed DMG prestige classes- the assassin and the shadowdancer are the only ones that do not siginficantly boost the power of the core classes at almost no cost. The loremaster is the worst culprit here, being a no-brainer for Diviners, which are already the best wizard specialists without the class. I want the prestige classes to have a 1 to 1 balance correspondence with the PHB classes rather than being blatant power ups.

5) Nerfed wands. Damage spells and healing spells aren't that problematic, but in general the idea that a spell trigger is less expensive per shot than a spell completion is absurd.

6) a flexible monk- it would be nice if there were several paths of powers that you could mix and match, so that you could do things like making sumo wrestlers who didn't have the movement capabilities and such- the monk is still my favorite class, but this would be nice, though difficult to balance

7) Organizations and roleplaying requirements for all prestige classes (at least examples)- without these, the classes are nothing but munchkinizing.

8) Nerfed archery- rapid shot and stacking enhancement bonuses make archery better than any other form of combat- it's got enough advantage as long as you're not retarded simply because of range- you have to use strategy without these, but with them when you do use strategy archery is horribly broken- i'd rather them assume non-retarded players, but that's not likely with the diablo generation being so dominant

 

[kenjib]

If, in a year, when a new 3rd party book or adventure comes out and it's still totally compatable with my 3.0 books in terms of spell lists, NPC stat blocks, etc. then I'll be happy. If I have to go through them and modify a ton of crap to make it compatable with my old books I'll be pissed and done buying any new d20 stuff as I don't want to have to rework everything I buy.

If compatable means, "well the mechanics are the same, but the classes are modified in terms of feats & skill lists, and the spell have changed in levels and descriptions in some cases. It will work fine with old material if you don't mind some inconsistancies..." But until the books hit I don't think I have much to whine about.

I totally agree. It works the other way as well. It would be a real pain in the buttnik even if you do use the revised rules to have to update all of the old material as well. Either way you are screwed. There will be a bit of a confusing mess to constantly sort through everything and ferret out subtle incongruities.

I strongly suspect that they do not really mean fully compatible when they say fully compatible because in the very same sentence they say there will be conversion notes for updating older material. Hmm...

On the other hand, I do agree that the rules could use some revision. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

What would my pet enhancement of choice be? Lots of new feats and feat chains that don't revolve around killing things and casting spells. That's all feats are good for in the core books. We need more feats that enhance social abilities and the roleplaying aspects of the game. I'd bet 50 to 1 odds though that a change like this will not be in the book.

Side note - the miniatures tie-in things worries me. I really dislike miniatures and playing on a mat. It takes the imagination out of the game for me. I hope the rules don't become even more miniature reliant than they already are.

 

[MerakSpielman]

Side note - the miniatures tie-in things worries me. I really dislike miniatures and playing on a mat. It takes the imagination out of the game for me. I hope the rules don't become even more miniature reliant than they already are.

Doesn't WoTC have a new line of miniatures coming out soon? How are they gonna make big bucks off of 'em if their core books don't heavily pimp the use of minis? Promoting mini use in the books makes business sense.

edit: Back before we used minis in my game, we never used flanking, 5' step, etc... It took a lot out of the strategic combat. Our group loves battlemats because it helps them visualize exactly where everybody is in relation to each other. This is important when using those big, area-effect spells...

 

[Balgus]

Whew!! I am sure glad I did not click *order* for my last order. My brother and a couple other people have shown interest in the game. And as a Christmas present, i was gonna buy them each a PHB and a set of dice- just to get the dice rolin D ).

But now hearing about this- i think I will just wait to see what happens. Maybe I can pick up a copy for myself- and get a good deal with the gaming store by getting 4 at a time...

Man- am i lucky...

 

[Nightfall]

The Sage is just glad that not everyone is complaining about the Creature Collection Revised as much as these books...

 

[Nail]

Re: Re: 3.1e!

This is my one fear: more errata. They have to fix 99.99999% of it in this edition to make it worth it for most I would think. And if there turns out to be more for the revisions I will not be impressed. I have faith that they will do right by it.

You can be assured there will be errata, in the sense of "mistakes". They happen in the printing of any content, bar none.

Now, if there are additional rules clarifications or out-right rule changes (e.g. Polymorph) after 3.1e is released....that's an open question.

 

[Drew]

Overall, this seems like a good thing. Sour grapes about buying new books aside, I'm in favor of anything that improves the game. Besides, I like supporting the industry with my hard earned money. Another $90 is a very small price to pay for a hobby that has brought me so many hours of entertainment, especially since I'll get brand new, shiny books.

What do you think the books will look like? I can hardly wait...

C'mon July.