WOTC undecided over OGL/GSL. Why you should care

[SSquirrel]

Earlier you were arguing about how dissimilar Pathfinder was from 3.5, and now you're arguing how similar they are? If you can't bother to keep your argument straight, I have no idea what you're doing trying to debate other people.

You had claimed they hadn't promised full compatibility. I disputed that. Actually read what is written b/c right now it merely appears you are just trying to pick fights. (Admins note I said APPEARS not YOU ARE..I'm trying to clarify here)

That's not what you were arguing before. I repeat, you said:And I pointed out a scenario where exactly that happened. Exactly that. And now you're trying to argue it's not for sale so it doesn't count, or they're obviously lying on the thread and they won't switch, or you didn't mean "someone who doesn't play a game system" but "someone who doesn't play Dungeons and Dragons". Stop trying to pretend you were right. You were wrong.

It was a thread asking what people would do. Typically people posting about how they will switch to whatever Paizo supports who have a tag stating "Pathfinder charter member" are already customers playing the game. NOT like in your example of people new to D&D buying up WotC and Paizo product for the first game.

This was a 9 page thread and not a single person on the first 2 pages said that they started playing D&D b/c of a Paizo adventure they saw. THAT was the scenario you put forth and has yet to be borne out as something that pretty much ever happens.

I don't see how comparing someone who doesn't play D&D seeing an adventure, then their whole group spending about $400 on various gaming products is anything close to the same as people saying they would continue playing Paizo products that remain 3.5 (no mention of a possible Pathfinder RPG spinoff) or that they would upgrade to 4E. One is a direct continuation by the parent company (4E), the other option is adventures put out supported by the 3.5 SRD.

//For clarity, here were Erik's 3 questions posed:
1) Do you plan to convert to the new edition of D&D?

2) If Paizo converts its RPG products to 4.0, how will that affect your purchasing patterns for our products?

3) If Paizo does not convert its RPG products to 4.0, how will that affect your purchasing patterns for our products?//

Start a new thread if you want to continue this or use my messages, we're veering way off-topic here.

 

[Umbran]

This site would hardly continue to exist if not for open gaming. It started as a 3E scoop site and quickly became the home of the open gaming movement and all the publishers.

Yes, somehow, why we should care about no open gaming for 4E isnt a main page thread. I still dont get that.

This site would hardly continue to exist if we didn't impose organization upon it. Without some segmentation, dealing with EN World is like drinking from a fire hose.

EN World, first and foremost, is (and has always been) here to discuss games - what people play, and how they play it. If we start to actively push threads about particular movements to center stage, we cease to be a place of communication, and we become instead a place to push particular agendas. There are other sites for that sort of thing.

 

[Melan]

Umbran: I would normall agree with you, and you are technically right, but this thread might be of wider general interest than what usually passes here. Very few people read OGF-L regularly (I certainly wouldn't have come here if I weren't linked to it from the Necro messageboards), but this may concern several people on this site... including their decisions to buy 4e or stay with 3.5 or an alternate system.

 

[Ydars]

With all due respect Umbran, Clark was not asking you to "move this thread to center stage", he was pointing out that I originally posted this in the main 4E forum and it was moved here by the MODS. It was attracting huge discussion and the whole point of it was to let people in the main area of the site discuss the issues surrounding OGL.

I wanted to do this becasue most people don't think OGL has anything to do with them and I was trying to point out some things they may not have considered. By moving this thread, my intention was partially thwarted.

I would appreciate having this moved to where I originally posted it; the 4E section of the site.

 

[AZRogue]

This site would hardly continue to exist if we didn't impose organization upon it. Without some segmentation, dealing with EN World is like drinking from a fire hose.

EN World, first and foremost, is (and has always been) here to discuss games - what people play, and how they play it. If we start to actively push threads about particular movements to center stage, we cease to be a place of communication, and we become instead a place to push particular agendas. There are other sites for that sort of thing.

What you say may be true, but I think Clark has a point. A thread about why people should care about the OGL is something that could be considered broad enough, as a subject, to be posted in the General forum without it being seen as "pushing an agenda" but simply as putting the question raised by the OP to a larger audience.

 

[Melan]

A thread about why people should care about the OGL is something that could be considered broad enough, as a subject, to be posted in the General forum without it being seen as "pushing an agenda" but simply as putting the question raised by the OP to a larger audience.

Moreover, what exactly is wrong with "pushing the agenda" of open gaming, something which strongly influenced the last eight years of the hobby? It is more important than the narrowly technical focus of this sub-forum.

 

[Nikosandros]

Umbran: I would normall agree with you, and you are technically right, but this thread might be of wider general interest than what usually passes here. Very few people read OGF-L regularly (I certainly wouldn't have come here if I weren't linked to it from the Necro messageboards), but this may concern several people on this site... including their decisions to buy 4e or stay with 3.5 or an alternate system.

Full agreement here. This thread, is of general relevance and shouldn't be relegated here.

 

[JohnRTroy]

We probably need to make a thread in the Meta forum, maybe a poll, asking if OGL-related threads should go back to the appropriate forum.

The forums name actually says it's the home of the new "OGL-F" list, and I think a lot of people ignore it when just discussing D&D. And technically, a GSL will be different from the OGL, so what's gonna happen if/when the GSL replaces the OGL.

I don't think the criticism about where the mods are putting these threads are unwarranted. I think the OGL forum is ignored by many people who have a vested interest in discussing these items. I've noticed that if a thread gets started in the other forum, once it's moved here it gets a lot less traffic. That hints that separating OGL subjects about D&D (or GSL about the future of D&D). What that tells me is that the forum structure setup is failing in some aspects.

ETA: I've posted a poll (about where to put such threads) in the meta forum, I suggest people vote there to let your feelings be known so the mods can take that into consideration.

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=222757

 

[Firevalkyrie]

Well, so far, they've only "pretended it doesn't exist," for two days on the weekend.

Seanchai

Quoted for emphasis. The internet works 24/7, but the Brand Team doesn't report to work until 8 AM Pacific (which is 11 AM Eastern) on Monday.

 

[mxyzplk]

Yeah, this thread isn't really about open gaming in general, it's specifically about whther 4e willb e open and therefore should be in the 4e forum. This forum is for discussing the details of OGL licensing and whatnot, not burying 4e discussions.