AI/LLMs Would you buy WotC products produced or enhanced with AI?

[Faolyn]

I think this is a good attitude to have and that most people can become decent at just about anything. But it's also important not to understate the importance of talent. Some people will progress much faster at certain things. Given limited time, it's not a bad idea to focus on your strengths.

It's art. There's no finish line.

Rembrandt was an artist. So was Rothko. Maybe you like one better than the other--maybe you think one was a total hack--but they're both artists who produced art.

 

[The Firebird]

And some folks just want all the tables, for free.

Isn't that...a good thing to want? Unless your house is full of tables, I suppose.

It's art. There's no finish line.

Rembrandt was an artist. So was Rothko. Maybe you like one better than the other--maybe you think one was a total hack--but they're both artists who produced art.

No disagreement here. The point was just that "make the art yourself" is not a good solution for everyone, because not everyone wants to or has the time to do so.

I think an example that zeros in on just the quality argument is mapmaking software. Take something like this page. It makes it much easier for me to generate maps for my RPG games. They're not as good as what you get from Mike Schley or Dyson Logos. And all the arguments MoonSong articulated can be expressed.

You know that creative commons is a thing right? Also, plenty of people -including yours truly- actually gift custom art from time to time. Besides, these users might even try to do it themselves, perhaps even discovering a related side hobby in the process?

There are creative commons maps; I could find a generous map maker to make a custom map; or I could try to do it myself. (Other arguments apply here too: the procgen program is not intelligent, it is not creative, it is not imaginative. It may even have negative effects on people who want to make and sell maps).

But none of these fit the bill. Creative commons maps don't always match what I want. Custom maps are much harder to come by. I enjoy map making but it takes me way longer; usually I'll take a procgen one and modify it as I need.

Does anyone find these arguments are still effective against the use of procgen maps? If not, then I submit that those arguments aren't actually convincing; it all comes down to the ethics.

 

[LordEntrails]

So what happens to our gaming community when 99% of us can publish our own adventures instead of 1% of us? What happens when the quality of self-published vs market leader diminishes to a trivial distinction?

We already have to admit that very few can make a living in the TTRPG industry. And most of those make a poor living at doing something they love. We also have to recognize that there is currently already more published material than any one of us can play in a lifetime.

 

[CleverNickName]

Isn't that...a good thing to want? Unless your house is full of tables, I suppose.

Or unless you are in the business of designing, producing, selling, and/or delivering tables.

 

[Incenjucar]

So what happens to our gaming community when 99% of us can publish our own adventures instead of 1% of us? What happens when the quality of self-published vs market leader diminishes to a trivial distinction?

We already have to admit that very few can make a living in the TTRPG industry. And most of those make a poor living at doing something they love. We also have to recognize that there is currently already more published material than any one of us can play in a lifetime.

Unfortunately, our civilization is much more focused on novelty than quality. Steady careers increasingly revolve around constantly finding new things to do more than doing one thing very well.

 

[CleverNickName]

Unfortunately, our civilization is much more focused on novelty than quality. Steady careers increasingly revolve around constantly finding new things to do more than doing one thing very well.

This is a very good point, and often overlooked in these discussions.

 

[Morrus]

These conversations are so identical to each other, with people repeating the exact same things for 80 pages as on all the other identical 80-page threads about AI and art, that I’m starting think the conversations are written by AI. Usually it’s one or two people doggedly trotting out the same pro-AI arguments we’ve all heard ad nauseam (broadly broken down into (a) scraping books and art without permission is not theft; (b) AI just does what humans do; and (c) but what about thems steam engines huh?), and a bunch of others butting heads against them. And nobody is budging an inch.

I wonder if it’s a conversation that even can be had. I suspect in the long run it’ll be ‘decided’ one way or the other in courts by powerful companies with a vested interest in IP protection and our endless philosophical logjams matter not one whit.

 

[Faolyn]

I think an example that zeros in on just the quality argument is mapmaking software. Take something like this page. It makes it much easier for me to generate maps for my RPG games. They're not as good as what you get from Mike Schley or Dyson Logos. And all the arguments MoonSong articulated can be expressed.

Sure. And this software was made by a person and does not, to the best of my knowledge, use material stolen from other people. And if you want to, you can follow the links to the creator's Itch.io page and donate.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

So what happens to our gaming community when 99% of us can publish our own adventures instead of 1% of us? What happens when the quality of self-published vs market leader diminishes to a trivial distinction?

Explosion of creativity. Diminishing the barrier of entry to publish great works will certainly be a net improvement to society.

We already have to admit that very few can make a living in the TTRPG industry. And most of those make a poor living at doing something they love.

Not all endeavour are suitable for making money. Given the proportion of amateurs vs professionals in other artistics fields (novel writing, singing...) it's not surprising that the same would be true for RPGs.

We also have to recognize that there is currently already more published material than any one of us can play in a lifetime.

Sure, but maybe not enough material suitable for everyone's specific taste (not everyone like D&D, not everyone like scifi...)

 

[Lazybones]

Just chiming in to say thanks to The Firebird for posting that link; it looks like an amazing resource and I've already grabbed a few maps to use in the adventure I'm currently building (I especially like the village map generator). I've been doing the same thing with the maps in Dyson Logos's thread, and have been using them to build a whole region of encounter locations for my home game.