(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
I think a Ring of Counterspells is pretty sweet for a cleric.
Dream Chaser, did you just ask for a nerf?
Dream Chaser, did you just ask for a nerf?
Wow, Freedom of Movement
- Thread starter Tellerve
- Start date
Camarath
Pale Master Tarrasque
Ug... They nerf the buff spells and allow this? Did anyone at all Break-Test these rules? I doesn't seems so. There are so many little flaws, oversights, and IMO misjudgements in this new edition that it makes me wonder if they applied any pressure at all to the system wile playtesting it. Alot of the changes are based on good ideas and systems but seem lacking in their integration with each other and the over all rule system. I am glad to see they made a very useful 4 level spell into a 4 level spell with potentialy more power than Mind Blank (8th level). I guess I will have to house rule this spell back to 3.0 or allows creatures that interact with the traget a save and SR to ingore the spell's effects.
I really don't see what the big problem is. It's a 4th level spell that you have to cast in advance (a cleric that stumbles into a room of angry monks ISN'T going to get the spell off) and clerics, if you've noticed in 3.5e, have been directed more towards defense than offense - hence the nerfing of buff spells, hold person, harm, etc. There's an implicit tradeoff and y'all need to get over it.
Edit: You are crazy if you think Freedom of movement is better than Mind Blank.
Edit: You are crazy if you think Freedom of movement is better than Mind Blank.
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Camarath
Pale Master Tarrasque
I like 3.5 it fixes many of the thing that needed fixing in 3.0. But I find it furstrating that a number of issue don't seem it have been worked through as thoroughly as I would have liked. I had house rules to fix the problems in 3.0 and just weeks after 3.5 comes out and I already have a list of fixes.
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Metalsmith
First Post
Always Played it this way.
I've always played it this way.
Being Grappled impedes your movement so it would seem to be coverd by the first sentence of the Spell Description in 3.0, "This spell enables you or the creature you touch to move and attack normally for the duration of the spell, even under the infllllluence of magic that usually impedes movement, such as hold person, paralysis, solid fog, slow and web spells."
This is a new change?Tellerve said:I haven't noticed anyone saying how nice this spell is so I'm assuming it has flown under everyone's radar. To let you all know, you now while under the influence of the spell automatically suceed in grapple checks to break out of grapple or pin. Also you succeed on any grapple check to resist a grapple attempt. Nice stuff
Tellerve
I've always played it this way.
Being Grappled impedes your movement so it would seem to be coverd by the first sentence of the Spell Description in 3.0, "This spell enables you or the creature you touch to move and attack normally for the duration of the spell, even under the infllllluence of magic that usually impedes movement, such as hold person, paralysis, solid fog, slow and web spells."
Camarath - I would like to hear what your list of fixes are to date. More specifically, what exactly are you fixing? How does one determine when a spell is 'broken'?
Let me present you with a scenario that explains my thoughts on this spell:
A 10th level cleric will be able to cast anywhere from 3-4 (assuming WIS is not over 26) 4th level spells not counting the domain spell. Chances are good that, in a normal session, he will want to convert at least one to a cure crit. wounds leaving 2-3 slots left. With spells like Divine Power, Summon Monster 4, Death Ward, and Greater Magic Weapon (not to mention other good ones), why would a cleric ever have more than 1 or 2 Freedom of Movement spells per day? It's just not that great. And at 10th-level, two FoM spells last for 200 minutes (about 3.5 hours) total - which means proper planning is necessary.
So tell me what's broken here?
Let me present you with a scenario that explains my thoughts on this spell:
A 10th level cleric will be able to cast anywhere from 3-4 (assuming WIS is not over 26) 4th level spells not counting the domain spell. Chances are good that, in a normal session, he will want to convert at least one to a cure crit. wounds leaving 2-3 slots left. With spells like Divine Power, Summon Monster 4, Death Ward, and Greater Magic Weapon (not to mention other good ones), why would a cleric ever have more than 1 or 2 Freedom of Movement spells per day? It's just not that great. And at 10th-level, two FoM spells last for 200 minutes (about 3.5 hours) total - which means proper planning is necessary.
So tell me what's broken here?
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Plane Sailing
Astral Admin - Mwahahaha!
So, Hedjun, you're saying that *prior* to 3.5 all fighters were automatically dead in grapples?!?
Vexed
First Post
Zog said
"I really don't see what the big problem is. It's a 4th level spell that you have to cast in advance (a cleric that stumbles into a room of angry monks ISN'T going to get the spell off) and clerics, if you've noticed in 3.5e, have been directed more towards defense than offense - hence the nerfing of buff spells, hold person, harm, etc. There's an implicit tradeoff and y'all need to get over it."
I agree with you. Except for the (a cleric that stumbles into a room of angry monks INS'T going to get the spell off). Being able to cast defensively (in our group) usually negates the option of getting an AOO on someone casting a spell. Around 8th level and up trying to stop a wiz/clr from casting by hitting them with an AOO is all but useless. (for example) With no positive con mod or any other bonus, they would still have better than a 60% chance to get their highest spell off. Anything after 12th level is whatever.......
Aside from that you are right on the money.
*Assuming you max out your concentration. Its been my experience most spellcasters attempt to do this : )
"I really don't see what the big problem is. It's a 4th level spell that you have to cast in advance (a cleric that stumbles into a room of angry monks ISN'T going to get the spell off) and clerics, if you've noticed in 3.5e, have been directed more towards defense than offense - hence the nerfing of buff spells, hold person, harm, etc. There's an implicit tradeoff and y'all need to get over it."
I agree with you. Except for the (a cleric that stumbles into a room of angry monks INS'T going to get the spell off). Being able to cast defensively (in our group) usually negates the option of getting an AOO on someone casting a spell. Around 8th level and up trying to stop a wiz/clr from casting by hitting them with an AOO is all but useless. (for example) With no positive con mod or any other bonus, they would still have better than a 60% chance to get their highest spell off. Anything after 12th level is whatever.......
Aside from that you are right on the money.
*Assuming you max out your concentration. Its been my experience most spellcasters attempt to do this : )
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