Your opinion on god killing?

Aaron L said:
Before you can answer this question you must answer another: Do you consider gods to be beings or plot devices?

Yes.

Gods IMCs are beings who are somehow attached to a plot device. First, one must detach the being from the plot device. Then one must kill the being, who will still likely be quite tough.

To take a RuneQuest example: Pavis the god was originally Pavis Elf-Friend, a hero. Now he is Pavis, god of the city called Pavis. The only way to actually kill Pavis would be to first destroy his city. Then you only have to deal with a hero who has been amassing power since before your entire lineage was born. Then you have to deal with the repurcussions of having disrupted the structure of Myth. Since Pavis's career began within mortal reality, the repurcussions will be relatively small, and probably played out in linear fashion from the time of his destruction.

Taking down the Red Goddess, on the other hand, would be much more difficult. She has managed to tie herself to the Moon (not just the rock in the sky, but "lunarity", itself). So, you have to destroy not only the Lunar Empire, but then you have to take down her Moon. Then there's still an unhappy being to take care of. But she's still less of a challenge than would be someone like Yelm, who is the Sun and who existed before mortal times began. One might actually have to become one of Yelm's mythological enemies to do it, and the results could destroy the universe--so have a substitute Sun waiting in the wings, just in case.

Of course, most deities have friends, who are very likely to also be deities. This can make matters a little complicated.

My advice: Start small. Eradicate a few very minor (less than a city in extent) hero religions, first. Then work up from there. Expect to make powerful enemies.
 
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In the Diamond Throne Campaign Setting, it is not clear what gods really are...
There are no Clerics (since it as an AU campaign). The thing that comes next to them are magepriests. But even they seem only gain access (mechanically at least - the background for a priest varies) to powerful spirits and outsiders.

I like the idea of a single small cult following a powerful outsider that still can be slain by mortals.
Imagine a litorian tribe worshipping a blood demon (what ever it might be in terms of rules). He demands them to go around killing others (drinking their blood and eating their flesh), and in exchance he grants thim a little power. (Maybe he bestows upon the power of rage or something like that...)

Since none of my players are active on this board (but if anyone is: stop reading NOW!)

In fact, I will use as the theme of base for an upcoming adventures for my players. :)

The final of the campaign as I plan it is the destruction of one of the few gods mentioned in the DT setting, specifically the demigodess "Verdella Thresam". Since she plans to destroy the world/plane (even if only as a side effect of her schemes to gain more power) itself, she makes a good target for the characters (especially the Giant Paladin, ahem Giant Inspector of the Diamond Throne).
But this fight will not be to simple or simply repeatable - specific items, magic phenomena, spells and allies will have to be in place to destroy her.
(And I am not going to give her real diety stats in the final battle against her - I don`t plan to use epic level rules or something like that...)

Mustrum Ridcully
 

Epametheus said:
The gods are manifestitions of concepts, given thought and form (and energy). The god of Truth is not actually Truth itself, but if Truth itself could think and act, it'd be very much like the god of Truth. Basically, a diety is a powerful spirit; how powerful depends on the god's standing.

If a god dies, the concept they represent doesn't die with them. Loki, Tyr, and Surtr may all die in Ragnarok, but Deceit, Honor, and Fire will not die with them.

This is exactly the approach I use IMC - gods are either ascended mortals or concrete manifestations of abstract concepts. In either case they can be challenged and physically defeated by mortals (eg in myth, Diomedes defeating Ares at Troy, or in literature, Moorcock's Eternal Champion battling various Lords of Chaos & other gods). Permanent god-killing normally requires going to that god's home plane as per 1st ed Legends & Lore and is usually beyond the power of mortals to accomplish - though the Russian cyber-mercenary Oleg Gadinsky once nearly killed the PC god Thrin with a hand grenade by throwing it onto Thrin's 'dispelled' body as it returned to Asgard - but can be achieved by powerful enemy gods; eg Thrin has killed both the Babylonian devil-god Druaga (a long-time foe since Thrin was 3rd level!) and Wotan the Hanged God (an evil aspect of his own pantheon-head Odin - since 1e L&L unaccountably rates Odin as 'Neutral Good', I assumed that hanging 9 nights from Yggdrasil had cast off Odin's less-pleasant Aspect, which took the German name Wotan as it appeared to Hitler on an alternative fantasy version of 20th century Earth and help the 3rd Reich in its attempted global conquest).
 

Oh, IMC last week 2 5th level PCs killed a 'god' - well, a Huge Monstrous Spider worshipped as the god Hlo-Hlo (name source of much mirth!) by degenerate jungle cannibals, but they _believed_ it was a god and it had at least 1 Witch-Doctor 'serving' it and casting divine spells, so who's to say it wasn't a 'god' in some sense? :)
This was the classic "Spiderbite" scenario from white Dwarf 60, updated to 3e. Actually the first D&D scenario I ever played in, ca 1985 (I died). :(
 

There are two kinds of divine entities in my game. Those that are bonded to some form of demi-plane (god) and those than are an embodiement of a concept (spirit).

Both gods and spirits are comparable in power. Gods have an external powersource (their demiplane) while the spirits have near total dominion within their aspect.

Slaying a god is possible but unless you can take control of their demiplane they will be reconsituted, albeit in a weaker form (a la The Primal Order system) until the demiplane's resources are consumed. Slay a spirit and the concept becomes free until someone else groks it and becomes the focal point.

Killing either is possible as divinity merely grants the "won't die from old age or mortal diseases" form of immortality. Either entity will die if they are injured and *believe* they will die. More than one spirit is suspected of never realizing their true power and dying a rather mundane and innocuous death. However once a spirit embraces their true nature they become most difficult to defeat and are typically harder to kill than a god, though when it happens it is more permanent.

No being in any of my cosmologies is truly omniscient though there are some that can know anything when they want to but won't know anything they don't actively desire to know (think god-like scrying; you can see just about anything but you have to know what you want to scry). Most divinations are the filtered perceptions of the entities' extraordinary senses.
 

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