ZEITGEIST Zeitvice: one GM's guide to the best AP

[arkwright]

Zeitvice has been updated to include Book 7.

I was wrong, my working draft hadn't touched Book 7- which isn't surprising since Book 7 proved to be an absolutely exhausting trial. Read through to see why.

I expect that more than most books, this one could benefit from community feedback, so please let me know if anyone thinks of any additional topics or problems that I should cover. Also please let me know if I have gotten book-canon crossed with my own game-canon, though I have double checked.

Thanks to Earth Seraph Edna for editing and adding a small editor/player's note to this Book.

Attached: me after finishing writing this book of Zeitvice.

 

[Falkus]

Huh, I really liked that. I've reviewed chapter seven a couple of times, but I never considered before that the players would be upset about not being able to influence the ultimate outcome, though I can see it now. To me, the main allure for players in Book Seven was discovery. Finally finding out what the ultimate goals of the Obscurati were, and discovering that they actually had the capability to carry them out.

I'll have to keep this in mind if I get here with my current camaign (here's hoping!)

 

[RangerWickett]

Arkwright, you make a lot of good points about the seventh adventure, but I do want to clarify that I never intended for the Obscurati to be getting planes from the Gyre. They were using telescopes to examine planar traits and create icons, and so had thousands of stars in the night sky to choose from. The PCs are the ones with limited options.

I suppose that raises the question of whether the PCs could ever have gotten their hands on the details and golden icons of the many Ob planes, and I'm sure if it weren't 3am I'd be able to think of a way to let them find some if they put some effort in.

 

[arkwright]

I think we've had this discussion about the Gyre planes before, Ranger. I believe the trouble is that, from my perspective, the Gyre planes map too neatly onto those discussed in Book 7 to be a coincidence, or at least for me to treat as a coincidence. I'll definitely add a line into Zeitvice clarifying that this is my interpretation, and explaining how the Ob use telescopes to create icons.

Sorry Ryan, not sure what you mean about the PCs getting their hands on the details and icons. I'd imagine either the PCs get briefed on the planes in Book 7 as part of infiltrating the convocation, or the pinch the Ob's stash of icons at some point in Book 10 or 12. I'd imagine that the Ob would make icons for every plane being considered, just in case. I might add that too.

I do worry that I'm falling into a trap of 'getting mad at a book because it's not doing something I think it should be doing.' As you have said before, you didn't intend Book 7 to be a super-detailed planar debate with the PCs playing a starring role. However I do believe there's enough detail in the debate and enough lines encouraging the party to take part that my position isn't unreasonable.

Book 7, page 2:
During the convocation the party learns the nature of the conspiracy’s plans, and can actually take part in the debate over how they want to change the world. The meeting lasts two days, during which the PCs can try to sway the conspiracy’s plans from within, recruit double agents, or do a bit of eavesdropping to learn the conspiracy’s weaknesses.

 

[Lylandra]

And here I thought that the Obscurati messed up so much with their failed ritual that they fired several planes straight to the Gyre... like, this is what happened to Urim, Nem and Reida (and Avilona before), right? And yes, the Gyre planes and the Obscurati proposals match quite well, but we might be biased as our DM used the planes of .

As a player, we also really wanted to understand the planar mechanism and influence the vote of the Obscurati. So our DM let us influence this part and let Nic go rogue after he learned that we had our hands in the vote. Also, it would be natural to have Ob scientists explain their planar proposals in detail to those who are interested and knowledgeable enough to understand them. But I can see why many groups would care less about Obs politics, especially those who like classical adventuring.

After playing ZG myself, having some exchange with Ranger in my own thread and reading a bit here and there, I would really love to see a clarified, fluffed up and errata-ed "complete lore nerd version" of Zeitgeist to make the story more stringent and offer even more perspective on the characters, the world and their development. Which would probably make these books twice as large, but it'd be totally worth it.

 

[arkwright]

I believe firing Urim/Nem/Reida into the Gyre wasn't intended, but it wasn't technically a mistake. This was always going to happen, as a result of a world being kicked out of the system due to the Axis Ritual. This is because the Gyre automatically scoops up any plane that is """doomed""" and the Axis-kicked planes qualify.

'Zeitgeist: Bigger, Longer and Uncut' would have been neat, but the time to do it would probably have been the 5e conversion.

Side note- anyone who read through Zeitvice Book 7 early, I have been updating it with a few new sections and some new lines in Planes and Planes/Lighthouses so it might be worth re-reading.

 

[tragicThaumaturge]

This is incredible. I just began skimming through the PDf and immediately came upon the part where you talk about Nic euthanizing his patients. I agree so much with you. Thank you for taking the time to put this together.

 

[RangerWickett]

In my conception, William Miller had tried to make a connection with a lot of Elfaivaran survivors in his care, and when he got Kasvarina on board, he planned to leave, and he knew that leaving people behind increased the risk of someone talking to them and finding out what he'd been up to.

 

[Crispy120286]

Any new updates or drafts on Zeitvice?

 

[Arcaneshield]

Yeah I'm on Diaspora and it's... interesting.