Zombie Solo

[Mesh Hong]

Yes I agree.

If you deviate too far from the range of "expected" stat levels, which if memory serves me right is 13+ 1/2 level then you will get flawed results.

The DMG states that a creatures primary stat should be +3, and in 99% of cases I would personally use no more than +4 to keep everything grounded in a consistant approach.

The Zombie Abomination in this thread has its primary stat at +6 which is throwing one of its defences slightly. If this was my creature then I would probably have put it a 18 which would have been +4 (just enough to bump its damage slightly as it is a brute solo). It also has one pair of stats that are at -4, which can translate as a slight but potencially significant weakness in a defence, again I might have been inclined to make it -2 which would have improved its Will defence by 1 point.

When I comment on someone elses creature I usually accept what ever stats they have given, assuming that is is part of the creature concept. Maybe this is flawed approach from myself and I should comment on the appropriateness of their stats.

 

[keterys]

Eh - except that it's often appropriate for stats to deviate from that baseline. After all, even a level 30 zombie might still be mentally deficient and slow-moving.

It's just not okay for the defenses to do so. Hence, the suggested change in method.

 

[Mesh Hong]

Eh - except that it's often appropriate for stats to deviate from that baseline. After all, even a level 30 zombie might still be mentally deficient and slow-moving.

It's just not okay for the defenses to do so. Hence, the suggested change in method.

Cool, that is an arguement I cannot disagree with at any level!

I havn't come accross this issue yet but I will certainly bear it in mind in my future endeavours. (actually it is a pretty extreme case but it clearly highlights the potencial problem with sticking blindly to stats and is a worthwile end to our discussion - thanks)

 

[Dragongrief]

I
Dwarf Toss (standard; recharge )
Target must be grabbed; The zombie launches the grabbed target at another opponent, grabbed target is now next to ranged target; two attacks. Range 10; +6 vs. AC; 1d8 +5 damage and knocked prone. Miss: grabbed target is prone in closest square next to ranged target

How about this for formating the attack:

(insert pre-info stuff. action, keywords, etc)

Target: One grabbed creature
Attack: +6 vs Fort (or AC if you prefer)
Hit: 1d8+5 damage. Choose a space within 10 squares - if it is unoccupied, the target is now prone in that square; if it is occupied by a creature, make a secondary attack against that creature. Target is no longer grabbed.
Secondary Attack: +6 vs Ref
Hit: 1d8+5 damage and target is prone. Primary target is prone in an adjacent square.

It does change the attack a little bit from the original version. The primary attack determines if the zombie was able to throw the creature, the secondary attack determines if it hit someone/thing else with the creature.

 

[Mesh Hong]

(insert pre-info stuff. action, keywords, etc)

Target: One grabbed creature
Attack: +6 vs Fort (or AC if you prefer)
Hit: 1d8+5 damage. Choose a space within 10 squares - if it is unoccupied, the target is now prone in that square; if it is occupied by a creature, make a secondary attack against that creature. Target is no longer grabbed.
Secondary Attack: +6 vs Ref
Hit: 1d8+5 damage and target is prone. Primary target is prone in an adjacent square.

That is so much neater than mine. This version is clean, clear and effective.

 

[Delgar]

Okay here is the new version of the Zombie Solo. Does it seem like it's a relatively balanced 3rd level solo and does it seem like it would provide an interesting encounter?

Thanks for all the comments so far.

Zombie Abomination 3 Solo Brute
Large undead XP 750
Initiative: +1 Senses: Perception +11;
HP 192; Bloodied 96 See also Bloodied Gore
AC 17; Fortitude 20, Reflex 14, Will 15
Speed 6
Saves: +5
Action points 2
Slam (standard; at will)
Reach 2; +6 vs. AC; 1d8 + 5 damage, and opponent is grabbed
Bite (standard; at will)
Reach 2; +6 vs. AC; 1d4 +5 necrotic damage and ongoing 5 necrotic damage (save ends)
Zombie Fury (standard; at will)
The Zombie makes 2 Bite or Slam attacks
Dwarf Toss (standard; at will)
Target: One grabbed creature
Attack: +6 vs Fortitude
Hit: 1d8+5 damage. Choose a space within 10 squares - if it is unoccupied, the target is now prone in that square; if it is occupied by a creature, make a secondary attack against that creature. Target is no longer grabbed.
Secondary Attack: +6 vs Reflex
Hit: 1d8+5 damage and target is prone. Primary target is pushed one square and knocked prone.
Sweeping Attack (standard; recharge )
Must have an opponent grabbed; Close blast 3 (must include grabbed opponent) +4 vs Reflex; 1d8 + 5 damage and any target hit (except the grabbed opponent) is pushed 3 squares
Necrotic Spray (immediate reaction, when a melee attack hits the zombie)
A necrotic ooze shoots out from the wound at the attacker: +4 vs Reflex; 1d6 + 3 damage and the target is dazed (save ends)
Bloodied Gore (Immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter)
The zombie erupts it’s Necrotic Ooze even if it hasn’t been recharged
Necrotic Ooze (standard, encounter) * Necrotic
Close Burst 5; +4 vs. Reflex; 2d6+3 and the target is dazed (save ends). Miss: Half damage
Alignment: Unaligned Languages: None
Str 20 (+6) Dex 12 (+2) Wis 10 (+1)
Con 16 (+4) Int 1 (-4) Cha 6 (-1)
Description: A large muscular, rotting, humanoid corpse covered in pustules oozing a black ichor.

 

[Mesh Hong]

Okay here is the new version of the Zombie Solo. Does it seem like it's a relatively balanced 3rd level solo and does it seem like it would provide an interesting encounter?

Thanks for all the comments so far.

Zombie Abomination 3 Solo Brute
Large undead XP 750
Initiative: +1 Senses: Perception +11;
HP 192; Bloodied 96 See also Bloodied Gore
AC 17; Fortitude 20, Reflex 14, Will 15
Speed 6
Saves: +5
Action points 2
Slam (standard; at will)
Reach 2; +6 vs. AC; 1d8 + 5 damage, and opponent is grabbed
Bite (standard; at will)
Reach 2; +6 vs. AC; 1d4 +5 necrotic damage and ongoing 5 necrotic damage (save ends)
Zombie Fury (standard; at will)
The Zombie makes 2 Bite or Slam attacks
Dwarf Toss (standard; at will)
Target: One grabbed creature
Attack: +6 vs Fortitude
Hit: 1d8+5 damage. Choose a space within 10 squares - if it is unoccupied, the target is now prone in that square; if it is occupied by a creature, make a secondary attack against that creature. Target is no longer grabbed.
Secondary Attack: +6 vs Reflex
Hit: 1d8+5 damage and target is prone. Primary target is pushed one square and knocked prone.
Sweeping Attack (standard; recharge )
Must have an opponent grabbed; Close blast 3 (must include grabbed opponent) +4 vs Reflex; 1d8 + 5 damage and any target hit (except the grabbed opponent) is pushed 3 squares
Necrotic Spray (immediate reaction, when a melee attack hits the zombie)
A necrotic ooze shoots out from the wound: +4 vs Reflex; 1d6 + 3 damage and the target is dazed (save ends)
Bloodied Gore (Immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter)
The zombie erupts it’s Necrotic Ooze even if it hasn’t been recharged
Necrotic Ooze (standard, encounter) * Necrotic
Close blast 5; +4 vs. Reflex; 2d6+3 and the target is dazed (save ends). Miss: Half damage
Alignment: Unaligned Languages: None
Str 20 (+6) Dex 12 (+2) Wis 10 (+1)
Con 16 (+4) Int 1 (-4) Cha 6 (-1)
Description: A large muscular, rotting, humanoid corpse covered in pustules oozing a black ichor.

Looks good.

Dwarf Toss - should probably be at +4 vs. Fort & +4 vs. Reflex
Necrotic Ooze - I would still prefer this as a Burst 3 attack, but if you are happy with Close Blast 5 then thats your choice.

As Keterys and I have discussed at some length, the product of boosting your zombies strength to well beyond the recommended value for a level 3 brute has had the effect of also boosting its Fortitude defence by an additional 2 points. Normally I would have expected a Fortitude defence of around 18 (that includes the +2 bonus from being a solo). Its not that major, but seeing as how Keterys and I expended the effort to discuss it in this very thread I thought I had better make you aware of it !

 

[keterys]

You could probably still have Dwarf Toss be +6 - I did that once for a brute that grabbed, thinking of it as 'sorta like combat advantage' for that attack. But, yeah, probably should be +4.

Anyhow, seems like good flavor to me and looks fun. I think technically Necrotic Spray should specify it's against the attacker, but I don't think it's something you need to worry about

 

[Delgar]

OOpps I meant to change the necrotic ooze to burst.

I wanted to keep the Dwarf toss attacks high because at +4 I think it makes it a rather weak special attack, one that isn't likely to succeed.

 

[Mesh Hong]

Yeah, I would keep Dwarf Toss at +6 as well, just so I could see it used. Its very cinematic throwing the PCs around, I'm sure your players will love it.