A Humble Request: A Non-Vancian "Leader" in the PHB

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Ritual healing.

Seriously, this is the answer that everyone seems to be looking for when it comes to healing.

Can I cast the ritual mid-combat, so that there can be exciting scenes mid-combat where the Rogue was almost killed and is short of dropping, but if the Cleric/Warlord uses a healing ability in time, he won't?

I don't think Rituals address this problem. They can address problems like "OMG, if I only heal 1 hit point per level per day, it'll take forever, but if we let much more heal, it's totally unrealistic".

 

[MarkB]

I voted for Cleric, Warlord and Something Else.

I could see some healing capacity being incorporated into a Warlock or similar class reasonably easily.

 

[Li Shenron]

Any class should be allowed to be a leader.

Not even a theme should be required, or any other mechanic. Mechanical elements could be used to help, but should not be strictly required.

 

[TwinBahamut]

Any class should be allowed to be a leader.

Not even a theme should be required, or any other mechanic. Mechanical elements could be used to help, but should not be strictly required.

Err, without mechanical support, it is literally impossible for a class to be a "Leader" in the sense it is being used in this thread. We're talking about the Leader role, not a leader using the more common meaning of the word. A class can't be a Leader unless it has healing and support abilities, and that needs mechanics.

Any player can take on the a position as a party leader regardless of class. I don't think that has ever been in question. But a character needs certain mechanics to have the Leader role.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Err, without mechanical support, it is literally impossible for a class to be a "Leader" in the sense it is being used in this thread. We're talking about the Leader role, not a leader using the more common meaning of the word. A class can't be a Leader unless it has healing and support abilities, and that needs mechanics.

Any player can take on the a position as a party leader regardless of class. I don't think that has ever been in question. But a character needs certain mechanics to have the Leader role.

Personally I wouldn't mind seeing a Leader that works without healing. Maybe a very minor sampling of temporary hit points, but a class that is build around the idea of assigning targets and tasks and granting people that follow his leadership/advice significant bonuses.

That is the 2nd component of most 4E leaders besides the obligatory heal Healing Surge + X 2/day, and one that actually was a much more interesting component of leaders, I think.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Glad to see the warlord getting some support.

 

[Leatherhead]

Sure, you can heal via those triggering actions, rather than by the unified central mechanic, but I prefer to have the unified mechanic and I prefer how healing surges play at the table. Healing mechanics work better when they are more finely controlled by such a central system.

It's not so much that you can heal via those actions, but rather you must heal via those actions. A healing surge on a fighter in the middle of combat can't do anything without a power to "spend" it. Healing surges are really just a cleverly worded limiter on the number of times per day you can be healed. It's the Surge Value mechanic that does all the uniform curing. But nobody talks about surge values.

Can I cast the ritual mid-combat, so that there can be exciting scenes mid-combat where the Rogue was almost killed and is short of dropping, but if the Cleric/Warlord uses a healing ability in time, he won't?

Yes, actually you can try to set up a ritual mid-combat, but it is quite risky to do so. You should be quite pleased with the "We have to protect the cleric for a few turns while he heals the rogue who is bleeding out" scenario this promotes if you are looking for that kind of drama. And quite frankly, it's more exciting if there is risk in healing rather than the relatively effortless "I spend a minor action to give them hp." Personally, I don't really like combat healing too much, as it creates those "Who is going to be the band-aid box for this campaign?" moments.

I don't think Rituals address this problem. They can address problems like "OMG, if I only heal 1 hit point per level per day, it'll take forever, but if we let much more heal, it's totally unrealistic".

Well, the problem in the op is "How do I get a non-Vancian healer?" Which this solves, because now healing isn't linked to spell slots.

For a non-Vancian Buffer, this doesn't help too much, but it is my understanding that this thread is focused on the side of leaders that promotes HP gain.

 

[Li Shenron]

Err, without mechanical support, it is literally impossible for a class to be a "Leader" in the sense it is being used in this thread. We're talking about the Leader role, not a leader using the more common meaning of the word. A class can't be a Leader unless it has healing and support abilities, and that needs mechanics.

Yes I also meant in the sense of the leader role, but first of all I oppose the idea of merging "leader" with "healer".

I notice that I phrased it pretty badly... of course there need to be some mechanics, but I meant that I don't want it required to pick a theme or feats or background or other character-building mechanical elements. I meant that I prefer the game to have mechanics such as "aid another" available to anyone in order to provide support to others, so that a PC can take on a leader role without necessarily "cost" a theme etc. (Then additional abilities, feats and themes too are ok if you want to boost your leader role's edge.)

 

[TwinBahamut]

It's not so much that you can heal via those actions, but rather you must heal via those actions. A healing surge on a fighter in the middle of combat can't do anything without a power to "spend" it. Healing surges are really just a cleverly worded limiter on the number of times per day you can be healed. It's the Surge Value mechanic that does all the uniform curing. But nobody talks about surge values.

I suspect no one talks about surge values because most people lump it in with the daily number of healing surges as part of the concept of the "Healing Surge mechanic". That's what I did. Healing surges are composed of both the daily healing surge limit and the surge value. Without both of those, it is something rather different than 4E's healing surge system.

That said, there are actually ways to build the healing surge system without relying on triggering actions. I've seen games with a somewhat similar system (SaGa Frontier 2's version of the HP/LP system), where something equivalent to healing surges (LP) could be spent pretty much as a free action, without even a per-round limit. The quirk of that version, though, was that a character died if they ran out of LP, and LP was lost whenever HP fell to zero or the character is attacked while unconscious. Healing that didn't drain LP was much more limited and required other resources and couldn't be used as a free action. It was an interesting system.

 

[Ahnehnois]

Ritual healing.

Seriously, this is the answer that everyone seems to be looking for when it comes to healing.

I could see that being a positive. The more mechanics you can get away from classes the better. Makes it easier to customize the game for DMs and players alike.