A Merc's Life [OOC 02]

[Maidhc O Casain]

You have it right - the rolls I made are for Tsadok's passive ability. Once you tell me you're searching actively - and where you're searching - I'll make another roll. Since it would make sense that the fourth statue is also trapped you would get a +2 favorable circumstance bonus to find what's there.

 

[Scotley]

Technically I should've made the roll for Keeland as well since this is one of those cases where knowing the result of the roll could influence actions. But in this case the cat was pretty well out of the bag with the whole 'Detect Magic discussion' anyway.

I figured the same and just made a roll. So do any of us have the skill to disarm said traps now that we know where they are?

 

[Scott DeWar]

third level spell Dispell magic!

other wise maybe a counter spell?????

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

Rogues - and only Rogues - can disarm magical traps. They can even 'bypass' the traps so that they and the party are not affected but the trap is still active.

DC is 25 + Spell Level used to create the trap, and the character will roll this one as it'll be obvious whether or not he succeeds (Fail by 4 or less and the trap is still active but the Rogue may try again; fail by 5 or more and the trap is sprung).

 

[Scotley]

I figured as much. Isn't Tsadok a Rogue?

 

[mleibrock]

request

Mikey,

I have a request. After we've missed finding a trap, would you please post our rolls? I know it's a passive thing so you want to roll so we don't have to worry about not allowing our characters to search more in depth, but I'd like to see the missed rolls.

I don't know about the others but I like rolling for myself but I understand why you want to do it this way. Either way, it would be nice to have it all documented.

Thanks

 

[Leif]

Come on, now, Mike L.! We've got to let him have his little secrets from us! It makes him feel so powerful and untouchable, you know. Just remember that all of our characters are only alive because of the benevolence of our gracious GM. Like the old saying goes, 'He brought us into this world, and, by God, he can take us out if he wants!'

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

Mikey,

I have a request. After we've missed finding a trap, would you please post our rolls? I know it's a passive thing so you want to roll so we don't have to worry about not allowing our characters to search more in depth, but I'd like to see the missed rolls.

I don't know about the others but I like rolling for myself but I understand why you want to do it this way. Either way, it would be nice to have it all documented.

Thanks

I was waiting for this question from you . . .

It is all documented, and I'll be happy (in the case of traps) to post the results after the encounter is over. As long as you've sprung the trap. If you missed finding it but didn't spring it, you might spring it on the way out.

However, in this case Tsadok's passive detection didn't even kick in. This particular trap (as written in the adventure, not made by me) is triggered from 10' away by anyone who is not a worshiper of Nethys. Your detection is only good from 5' or less.

Harnry was the only one who actually specified he was looking. I gave him a roll even though he didn't specify that he was searching for traps. I even gave him the +2 for using Detect Magic and didn't give him any negative modifiers in spite of the fact that he's 35 or 40 feet away. He didn't see it.

I sort of feel like I need to correct a misunderstanding about my motives. I in no way think of this as 'GM vs. Players.' I don't jump up and down and do a victory dance when you miss a trap or get hit by a critter. And I do believe that you should - at least occasionally - kick some righteous ass. (In fact, this group's walked through almost every fight in the adventure with hardly a scratch, must less a true test of your mettle. Which is fine with me, because I know the encounters have been run the way they were supposed to be - the way they were written - and your successes have been earned rather than given away.)

I want the party to succeed for two reasons: because it's no fun to fail all - or even most of - the time, and because that's the only way the game continues. But I also believe that success shouldn't be a foregone conclusion. If it is, why bother to set up the encounters or roll the dice at all? And I believe that the players (and characters) should be challenged and tested, and that their resources should be used - and even used up. Otherwise why bother to place any limits on the creation process? Why not just let them have whatever stats, abilities and equipment they want from the start? (There are games that do that, but even they present the chance of failure - see the Wushu rules in my 'RPG Repository' if you're interested in reading about one such).

Does all that make sense?

PS: In many cases I will not give you the actual result of Perception rolls, or Knowledge rolls, etc. because doing so would defeat the purpose of making those rolls myself. For example: Tsadok examines a document using his Linguistic skill. The skill check is a natural one, which is actually bad enough that not only is he not able to interpret it he makes a mistake - he thinks he interpreted it correctly but he's actually drawn a faulty conclusion from it. Knowing the roll result would clue you in to that. Similarly, knowing you didn't roll high enough to find anything in a room or to locate a secret door is an indication to the player that you should check again. Your characters would have no idea whether they didn't find anything because there's nothing there or because they just didn't do a good enough job of searching. But knowing you rolled a 1 on the check means "OK, try again!"

 

[Scotley]

Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown.

This DM thing is tough. It is always a challenge to maintain the veil of willing disbelieve and reveal the mechanics underneath. I personally don't mind if we never know the results of the rolls, but I do understand that many players do want to know.

I usually let the players roll even when it gives them unfair knowledge of the situation. In play by post especially, it seems to me to be more important to maintain a rapid flow of information rather than maintain the secret. That's why I often post a tree of results and trust to the players not to peek at the results higher than they rolled. If they choose to look and find out things their characters would not know I figure they just spoiled some of the fun for themselves. Maybe someday they'll realize it is more fun to wait and see. I don't think it hurts the game much given that one of their fellows will reveal the info soon enough anyway.

That's my two coppers worth.

 

[mleibrock]

Yep

I was waiting for this question from you . . .

It is all documented, and I'll be happy (in the case of traps) to post the results after the encounter is over. As long as you've sprung the trap. If you missed finding it but didn't spring it, you might spring it on the way out.

However, in this case Tsadok's passive detection didn't even kick in. This particular trap (as written in the adventure, not made by me) is triggered from 10' away by anyone who is not a worshiper of Nethys. Your detection is only good from 5' or less.

Harnry was the only one who actually specified he was looking. I gave him a roll even though he didn't specify that he was searching for traps. I even gave him the +2 for using Detect Magic and didn't give him any negative modifiers in spite of the fact that he's 35 or 40 feet away. He didn't see it.

I sort of feel like I need to correct a misunderstanding about my motives. I in no way think of this as 'GM vs. Players.' I don't jump up and down and do a victory dance when you miss a trap or get hit by a critter. And I do believe that you should - at least occasionally - kick some righteous ass. (In fact, this group's walked through almost every fight in the adventure with hardly a scratch, must less a true test of your mettle. Which is fine with me, because I know the encounters have been run the way they were supposed to be - the way they were written - and your successes have been earned rather than given away.)

I want the party to succeed for two reasons: because it's no fun to fail all - or even most of - the time, and because that's the only way the game continues. But I also believe that success shouldn't be a foregone conclusion. If it is, why bother to set up the encounters or roll the dice at all? And I believe that the players (and characters) should be challenged and tested, and that their resources should be used - and even used up. Otherwise why bother to place any limits on the creation process? Why not just let them have whatever stats, abilities and equipment they want from the start? (There are games that do that, but even they present the chance of failure - see the Wushu rules in my 'RPG Repository' if you're interested in reading about one such).

Does all that make sense?

PS: In many cases I will not give you the actual result of Perception rolls, or Knowledge rolls, etc. because doing so would defeat the purpose of making those rolls myself. For example: Tsadok examines a document using his Linguistic skill. The skill check is a natural one, which is actually bad enough that not only is he not able to interpret it he makes a mistake - he thinks he interpreted it correctly but he's actually drawn a faulty conclusion from it. Knowing the roll result would clue you in to that. Similarly, knowing you didn't roll high enough to find anything in a room or to locate a secret door is an indication to the player that you should check again. Your characters would have no idea whether they didn't find anything because there's nothing there or because they just didn't do a good enough job of searching. But knowing you rolled a 1 on the check means "OK, try again!"

I understand why you run the campaign the way you do, Mike, and I don't really think you are out to get us. It just feels like we are not in control of our character's destiny as much as in some other games. Guess that's just something the players deal with if they want to play in your game. All good.