Bards and redundant "morale" bonuses

[Joshua Randall]

I just noticed that Bards have multiply redundant ways to give people morale bonuses:

An affected ally receives a +1 morale bonus on saving throws against charm and fear effects and a +1 morale bonus on attack and weapon damage rolls.

This spell imbues a single creature with great bravery and morale in battle. The target gains a +2 morale bonus on attack rolls, saves, and skill checks.

This spell instills powerful hope in the subjects. Each affected creature gains a +2 morale bonus on saving throws, attack rolls, ability checks, skill checks, and weapon damage rolls.

Bards would be a lot more effective at buffing their allies if they had some different bonus types that could stack!

 

[Thanee]

Yes, that's a bit annoying. Our bard didn't pick up any of those spells, because of the redundancy.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Bad Paper]

Bards would be a lot more effective at buffing their allies if they had some different bonus types that could stack!

"More effective" meaning "broken," I presume. It's not like they're ineffective or underpowered or anything, and being able to lay down the morale bonus all day long really adds up. It means that other buff-casters can lay off the morale bonusses, because hey Devis has it covered.

 

[Jack Simth]

I just noticed that Bards have multiply redundant ways to give people morale bonuses:



Bards would be a lot more effective at buffing their allies if they had some different bonus types that could stack!

Yeah.... but it really fits the flavor of the bard as a class that they are morale bonuses (they cheer people up with their singing .... or goad them on .... or inspire them to heights of competence by insinuating that they aren't quite that good .... or {insert other flavors here}

 

[Lord Pendragon]

It's not like they're ineffective or underpowered or anything

Sez who?

 

[A Man In Black]

"More effective" meaning "broken," I presume. It's not like they're ineffective or underpowered or anything, and being able to lay down the morale bonus all day long really adds up. It means that other buff-casters can lay off the morale bonusses, because hey Devis has it covered.

Heaven forbid that the class whose closest thing to a specialty is buffing be even close to as good at buffing as a cleric.

 

[Whimsical]

Keep in mind that heroism was originally part of the emotion spell, which was split up into individual spells in 3.5. So it was kept in the bard's list just because emotion was, without considering the redundancy.

But it does have the advantage of longer duration. Would a PC bard pick heroism for one of his precious spell slots? Probably not. But it does allow the bard to use the spell from a scroll or wand automatically. And it would make sense that bard could make magic items that uses heroism as a prerequisite, wouldn't it?

 

[Merlion]

Keep in mind that heroism was originally part of the emotion spell, which was split up into individual spells in 3.5. So it was kept in the bard's list just because emotion was, without considering the redundancy.

No, it wasnt. Good Hope was. Potions of Heroism have been in D&D more or less forever, and I think the spell may have existed in some 2nd edition supplement, but in 3.5 they finally decided to make the spell core along with the potion.

Heaven forbid that the class whose closest thing to a specialty is buffing be even close to as good at buffing as a cleric.

Actually, despite my overall position that the Cleric is overpowered and walks all over everyones toes...and that in particular the Cleric steals the Bard's "jack of all trades" thunder...the Bard actually is better at buffing other people, for combat. Most of the Clerics best melee buffs are self only (allowing them to usurp the Fighter's role) but they have few other particuarly good melee buffs for others. They are however the best their is at anti magic buffs.



I dont really understand why Heroism would need to be a morale bonus. I dont see why it couldnt be enhancement or even ~gasp~ unnamed. So the Bard would have at least one other bonus type.

 

[shilsen]

Don't forget that the Inspire Courage ability, Heroism (or Greater Heroism) and Good Hope don't provide exactly the same benefit. The first doesn't give a bonus to most saves or to skill checks, which Heroism does. And Heroism affects only a single creature, while Good Hope affects a group (and also provides bonuses to ability checks and damage checks). So it's not as if any of them make the others completely redundant.

 

[sfedi]

Heaven forbid that the class whose closest thing to a specialty is buffing be even close to as good at buffing as a cleric.

Bard speciality is social interaction, not buffing.