Catwoman Movie (threads merged)

[Piratecat]

Halle Berry is BI-RACIAL. Her mother is as white as the driven snow.
Maybe it doesnt bother so much now, eh?

Whoa, there. There's a difference between being racist and complaining that a character has been changed from the original concept. In this case, though, I agree that race has very little to do with the character.

It's best not to attribute racist motivations when it's not justified. Please feel free to email me if you want to discuss this further.

 

[stevelabny]

a few comments

1> changing the characters race is completely unimportant unless it changes their fundamental character. example: Luke Cage would have to be black. Otherwise it doesnt matter. I still don't get the uproar over Michael Clarke Duncan's Kingpin. Kingpin's main comic book trait is his immense physical size. not that hes white. And Duncan is about as big as you can get. Catwoman's race is unimportant. But it is required she be sleek and agile and some sort of villain, even if they turn her into one of the Robin Hood variety.

2> DC also decided somwhere along the line to try to make all their tv shows and movies appeal to a mainstream audience rather than geeks. The "new" Marvel movies (excpet for hulk) know that comics are so cool at their core,that EVERYONE can relate to them, and there is no need to radically alter them for the general public. Unfortunately for DC, the "mainstream audience" is just a littel more geeky than it use to be as the sucess of LOTR, Harry Potter, Spider-man and X2 show.

3> the phrase "evil cosmetics company" should never be used.

4> the catwoman movie, the next batman movie, and the flash show will SUCK.

 

[Villano]

a few comments

1> changing the characters race is completely unimportant unless it changes their fundamental character. example: Luke Cage would have to be black. Otherwise it doesnt matter. I still don't get the uproar over Michael Clarke Duncan's Kingpin. Kingpin's main comic book trait is his immense physical size. not that hes white. And Duncan is about as big as you can get.

I can understand people objecting to changes in race and sex if you are a fan. Just as changing a costume, origin, etc. My lack of concern with Catwoman's race is due to the fact that I'm not a huge fan (although I am enjoying the new series).

Of course, she could be a pink hippo and it wouldn't matter considering all the changes in the movie.

With the DD movie, more people were concerned with the changes to Bullseye than Kingpin, I think. Although, even Duncan remarked, when offered the role, "How did a black guy become the head of the Italian mob?", so there is a bit of a logic reason.

IMO, it all comes down to how much is the character changed by altering one thing. If the Flash is now black, no big deal. However, if Wonder Woman is, how are you going to handle the whole Greek myth angle? Whether or not there was a large population of black people in ancient Greece won't matter to the genreal audience who will most likely be confused.

 

[ShinHakkaider]

Whoa, there. There's a difference between being racist and complaining that a character has been changed from the original concept. In this case, though, I agree that race has very little to do with the character.

It's best not to attribute racist motivations when it's not justified. Please feel free to email me if you want to discuss this further.

Wait, dont get it twisted.

He obviously had a concern about the character being black, I pointed out the actress is at least part white. So he should feel a bit less concerned now.

As a fan of comics and RPG's, who is also a black man I'm sooooooo tired of hearing fanboys bitch and moan about blacks being cast in movies that they feel they shouldnt be in. Yes I know comic book and RPG industry is about 95% white, but there are times that a little variety does do some good. SO everytime I hear "why John Stewart" or "she's not black in the comic" it sets me right off...

 

[Brother Shatterstone]

Actually I think she was rather ticked off about them using her cat, I think its name was Iciest, but it's been more than a few years so I could be wrong.

As for the other issues, I don't think anyone in here is upset at the race of catwoman I think everyone is a tad worried about them being loyal to the character, which they should be as WB has been complete and utter failure when it comes to being loyal to a character. I didn't see anything wrong with the Michael Clarke Duncan being Kingpin as there isn’t that many people the right size to play Kingpin so their was little to no choice. I don’t see it in this case as there is penalty of other choices and this is simply a lack of loyalty to the character and that the part that bugs me… Why does WB, who owns the rights to all of the characters, make huge revolutionary change to their character? Doesn’t make good business since to me, why not make it as loyal to the comic book as possible and hope that you can draw new readers in?

Anywho if someone ones to label me a racist cause of that so be it but know some of my other views; I thought that “James Stewart” over Hal Jordan was a great call. As he much more of the catalyst that is needed than Hal Jordan could ever be. Kingpin see above, and on the annoyance scale Catwoman’s race ranks way below the trash they have produced as Batman movies, and also way below the whole Batman uniform “Nipple” thing. *Shudders*

Hopefully everyone realizes that I’m more annoyed at the lack of loyalty then I am about race.

 

[Tarrasque Wrangler]

Just to further muddy things, remember that the Catwoman in Batman: Year One was clearly African-American. And a pretty kickbutt Catwoman, too.

 

[Aaron L]

Eh, I just don't like Halle Berry.

Between the Flash and this Catwoman movie, I feel a little sick to the stomach.

 

[Fast Learner]

Unless the race/ethnicity of the character is somehow a key part of the character's persona, I don't care at all what actor plays a role. Drew Carey, for example, would make a terrible Kunta Kinte because race/ethnicity is a key concept for the character's persona. Catwoman's race/ethnicity, however, isn't part of her persona at all, so it doesn't matter in the least to me.

Interestingly (to me), however, gender does matter. I wouldn't mind a Spider-Man movie with an Asian Peter Parker, for example, but I would be quite disappointed with Penny Parker being bitten by a radioactive spider and becoming the very same character as Spider-Man. (Note that a Martha Franklin Spider-Woman movie would be fine, as she's a completely different character.)

Hmm. Double standard or some kind of root belief that gender is always a big part of persona while race/ethnicity need not be (though it certainly can be)? Interesting.

 

[Green Knight]

The cats name in the cartoon was Isis.

As a fan of comics and RPG's, who is also a black man I'm sooooooo tired of hearing fanboys bitch and moan about blacks being cast in movies that they feel they shouldnt be in. Yes I know comic book and RPG industry is about 95% white, but there are times that a little variety does do some good. SO everytime I hear "why John Stewart" or "she's not black in the comic" it sets me right off...

Quick question. How would you like it if they were to make a Green Lantern movie and cast the role of John Stewart as a white guy? I know I wouldn't like it at all. It cuts both ways. More than likely, the fanboy who's aghast at the thought of Halle Berry playing Catwoman would also be aghast at the thought of a white guy playing John Stewart, Blade, Bishop, etc. It isn't about race, but about wanting the closest representation of the comics character translated to film, which is a subject that goes far beyond race (Like the bitching about Spider-Mans webshooters in the movie being organic). For instance, George Clooney is white, as is Batman, but he does NOT look like Batman, which made me and many other fans aghast at the thought of his casting. Recently, I heard that George Clooney could potentially play Reed Richards in a Fantastic Four movie (Turned out to not be true, thank God). Once again, I was aghast. Why? Because George Clooney looks NOTHING like Reed Richards. For most fans, it has nothing to do with race and EVERYTHING to seeing the onscreen character staying as true to the character they've read about for years as possible (Also, incidentally, why I was all for Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin. I can't think of ANY other actor who could replicate the Kingpin's physique).

 

[JoeBlank]

Disclaimer: Piratecat, I would love for us to be able to continue the race debate in a mature fashion. If you don't think that is possible, I'll understand.

ShinHakkaider, I think PC called it right on. In this case at least, I don't think any of the objections are motivated by racist feelings. Most often, we fanboys (and fangirls) get worked up over changes that seem arbitrary. Witness the endless debates over the most minor details in the LoTR movies.

I am a big Daredevil fan, but I am also a Michael Clarke Duncan fan. When I heard he was cast as Kingpin, I was thrilled. I said before that I am opposed to arbitrary character changes, but I do not have any problems with a race change, made to allow a good actor/actress to play the part. As others have said, this is fine as long as race is not a defining characteristic of the character.

In fact, I was far more concerned that Jennifer Garner does not look Greek (and I am a fan of Ms. Garner and Alias, I just did not think she was right for the part).

For the record, I have no problem with Catwoman being black, although I am no fan of Halle Berry.

SO everytime I hear "why John Stewart" or "she's not black in the comic" it sets me right off...

Again, I think you are mistaking the intentions of those who complain about Jon Stewart in the Justice League cartoon. He is one of my favorite Green Lanterns, but for THE cartoon, many felt that they should use the definitive, iconic versions of the characters. That means Hal Jordan. Some did not like Wally West for the same reason, but in my opinion he has become the definitive Flash, and has been that character for some time now (braces for flames).