Death Ward and Necromancers

[frankthedm]

Right, so by your argument I'd say death ward does nothing vs. death attacks. Yet you say it does.

Even if there was any question on death attacks ...

Death Attacks
In most cases, a death attack allows the victim a Fortitude save to avoid the affect, but if the save fails, the character dies instantly.
*Raise dead doesn’t work on someone killed by a death attack.
*Death attacks slay instantly. A victim cannot be made stable and thereby kept alive.
*In case it matters, a dead character, no matter how she died, has -10 hit points.
*The spell death ward protects a character against these attacks.

I'd say that [Death] == "death spells". But, "magical death effects" MUST be different, so what could that be except something like phantasmal killer or blasphemy?

The Death domain power would be a magical death effect.

DEATH DOMAIN
Granted Power: You may use a death touch once per day. Your death touch is a supernatural ability that produces a death effect. You must succeed on a melee touch attack against a living creature (using the rules for touch spells). When you touch, roll 1d6 per cleric level you possess. If the total at least equals the creature’s current hit points, it dies (no save).

You are right Blasphemy is not a [death] effect. Death ward won't stop it, but Raise Dead works on the victim. It even destroys undead.

Blasphemy
Evocation [Evil, Sonic]
....
Up to caster level –10 Killed, paralyzed, weakened, dazed
...
Killed: Living creatures die. Undead creatures are destroyed
...

Now a place where you can see an attack that sometimes is a death effect, sometimes is not a death effect, is the Slaying Arrow...

Slaying Arrow: This +1 arrow is keyed to a particular type or subtype of creature. If it strikes such a creature, the target must make a DC 20 Fortitude save or die (or, in the case of unliving targets, be destroyed) instantly. Note that even creatures normally exempt from Fortitude saves (undead and constructs) are subject to this attack. When keyed to a living creature, this is a death effect (and thus death ward protects a target). To determine the type or subtype of creature the arrow is keyed to, roll on the table below.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Whoa, are we in a competition to see who can quote the most text from the SRD? I missed the memo. Did you actually have comments in your post?

 

[Dinkeldog]

Let's be civil in here, please.

 

[frankthedm]

Whoa, are we in a competition to see who can quote the most text from the SRD?

No, I just don't want to leave out text that might help or hurt my standpoint on the rules. I copy and past the SRD because there are a good portion of folks who seem to doubt me more than the SRD. I have seen rules questions and debates go on and on and yet swiftly end once the relevant paragraph from the SRD was posted. I also post large chunks of SRD because in my experience, too many folks quit reading a sentence too soon and sometimes even deliberately misquote the rules in the manner that movie advertisements misquote critics.

On your action, before making attack rolls for a round, you may choose to subtract a number from all melee attack rolls and add the same number to all melee damage rolls.

When he was told to read the entire entry…

On your action, before making attack rolls for a round, you may choose to subtract a number from all melee attack rolls and add the same number to all melee damage rolls. This number may not exceed your base attack bonus. The penalty on attacks and bonus on damage apply until your next turn.

And I have seen worse online where people stop in the middle of a sentence because the rest of it ruins their argument.

Did you actually have comments in your post?

I'll take that as constructive criticism that the posts need some clean up.

 

[Lela]

I'll take that as constructive criticism that the posts need some clean up.

Nicely color schemed. I like the green--easy to read.

 

[Whimsical]

Whoa, are we in a competition to see who can quote the most text from the SRD? I missed the memo. Did you actually have comments in your post?

Some people would rather prove than argue. People like me, for example. My question to you is: can you prove otherwise?

 

[hong]

Nicely color schemed. I like the green--easy to read.

Not in the Stealth style, though. Please, no funky colour effects, people!

 

[Infiniti2000]

Even if there was any question on death attacks ...

Agreed.

The Death domain power would be a magical death effect.

Agreed.

You are right Blasphemy is not a [death] effect. Death ward won't stop it, but Raise Dead works on the victim. It even destroys undead.

Wait, this is where you fail to support your position. Blasphemy is not a [death] effect, but why is it not a "magical death effect"? Can you respond to my (unsupported) claim that [death] spells are "death spells" and therefore "magical death effects" must be something other than [death] spells?

For the record, I really appreciate you separating the quotes from your statements. I don't mind quotes unless I can't tell the difference between a quote and your text and until you color coded them (though use quote blocks work as well), I couldn't.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Some people would rather prove than argue. People like me, for example. My question to you is: can you prove otherwise?

The fact is that death ward lists four things that it blocks. Two are clear, I think, energy drain and negative energy effects. Death attacks is a fifth thing not mentioned in the spell, but elsewhere (under the special ability of the same name, not surprisingly). The other two, however, are not clear. Death spells, IMO, are spells with the [Death] descriptor. I would make this claim because it explicitly mentions spells and only spells have descriptors. Since "magical death effects" are listed separately, then they must be something else. As Frank mentions, the Death domain power would be one, but I see no reason not to include blasphemy or phantasmal killer. The line about not protecting against other lethal attacks only refers to hit point damage (or Con damage perhaps). In other words, damage/attacks that are not "magical death effects" and it's quite provable that blasphemy is a magical death effect.

1. It's magical.
2. It causes death (directly, not through hit point damage, suffocation, or other means).
3. It's an effect.

That's the proof. There's not much more than that and I don't think there's ANY support at all to say that blasphemy is not blocked.

 

[hong]

I would make this claim because it explicitly mentions spells and only spells have descriptors.

What, so red dragon breath is not a magical fire effect?