Demonomicon - after the big 14?

[sckeener]

Aren't they both dead now, though? I seem to recall the archdevil being offed during Elminster in Hell and the Babylonian god (or Untheric, in this case) being reported KIA during the Orcgate Wars in Powers & Pantheons.

Didn't Marduk have a similar problem, too?

The Untheric god's demise just means that Faerûn is closed to the Babylonian gods. I assume they could be resurrected, but Ao would have to allow that I would think.

Ao might. He was the one that allowed them to come there in the first place.

 

[Shemeska]

Aren't they both dead now, though? I seem to recall the archdevil being offed during Elminster in Hell and the Babylonian god (or Untheric, in this case) being reported KIA during the Orcgate Wars in Powers & Pantheons.

Didn't Marduk have a similar problem, too?

Babylonian Nergal's avatar on Toril (his so-called god-king manifestation that the untheric gods used to get around the Imaskari barrier) was killed during the Orcgate Wars, which removed his deific presence from FR, but back on the planes at large, Nergal is still there in his deific domain on the Gray Waste, still worshipped on a multitude of worlds (just no longer on Toril).

Baatorian Nergal... good question. He was ostensibly killed in the events of Elminster in Hell, except the novel doesn't exactly use Baator, but rather Greenwood's own vision of the place that doesn't (from what we see in the novel) really take into account some of the developments to the plane since his early 1e articles in Dragon. For instance the novel has Geryon seemingly still holding some proper political authority and in official command of a force of fiends. I can't say if Ed was ignoring Geryon's change since 1e (either intentionally, or just not knowing it, or using the retroactive FR cosmology change to just go crazy) but I suppose it then brings into question if stuff in bizarro Baator should be included for purposes of canon in Baator in other sources.

If FR is going to claim to operate in a seperate cosmology, then nominally material dealing with the planes at large shouldn't be beholden to recent things in a self-proclaimed totally seperate cosmology, even in Baator* which is exactly like Baator but totally different and not connected, etc etc.

That said, in this particular case I'd personally go with the exiled archfiend Nergal as being dead, killed by some version of the events in EiH, assuming Toril to be playing in the same sandbox as everyone else.

 

[NiTessine]

I keep forgetting that separate cosmologies thing. It really does make this a lot harder on the brain. I really, really wish they hadn't done that. It makes setting continuity a great deal more complicated than it needs to be, even if one does one's best to ignore it like me...

Concerning the name-dropping of fiends... thus far my favourite was the naming of Fall-from-Grace in Malcanthet's Demonomicon article. It filled me with joyful glee.

Personally, after the big 14, I'd prefer to see Alzrius, the Queen of Chaos, and maybe Eltab and Yrsillar. I have a soft spot for the Lord of Nothing after reading Shadow's Witness.

 

[Ripzerai]

The exiled archdevil Nergal is still alive, and still exiled in Avernus, as of Fiendish Codex II.

The Babylonian deity is still around as of Dragon #329, and the Planescape setting (where he assisted in the murder of Enki).

 

[KL]

Demonomicon Candidate

Personally I think Miska the Wolf Spider and the QUeen of CHaos should be next, as the Rod of Seven Parts has been mentioned several times in Dungeon magazine. Another candidate that has been overlooked is Ilsidahur. He was actually stated in Dungeon #10, or Siragle, who was also statted. In any case, it be interesting to see the demon lords from the MM2 list developed, and I think Eblis, Aseroth and Azazel should take precedence as they were actually mentioned in H4: Throne of Bloodstone.

As for Nergel and Ereshkigal, one has to remember the there is a SLIGHT difference between NERGEL and NERGAL. As for Ereshkigal, didn't she showed up as a deity (under slightly different spelling as Erishkigal) in the second edition module Return to the Keep on the Borderlands?

Oh, whatever happened to the Dire Whiner and Quoalnargn?

 

[James Jacobs]

Personally I think Miska the Wolf Spider and the QUeen of CHaos should be next, as the Rod of Seven Parts has been mentioned several times in Dungeon magazine. Another candidate that has been overlooked is Ilsidahur. He was actually stated in Dungeon #10, or Siragle, who was also statted. In any case, it be interesting to see the demon lords from the MM2 list developed, and I think Eblis, Aseroth and Azazel should take precedence as they were actually mentioned in H4: Throne of Bloodstone.

Oh, whatever happened to the Dire Whiner and Quoalnargn?

As far as I'm concerned, the Dire Whiner can stay forgotten. Worst Demon Ever.

 

[BOZ]

the name, at least, should tip people off.

 

[sckeener]

So what is the last Demonomicon going to be about or are there going to be two?

 

[BOZ]

well, given recent developments... this thread has turned out to be even more worthless than i'd imagined.

should i start a new poll to see who people would rather see for #359 - Orcus or Graz'zt?

 

[Nightfall]

Boz,

Yes! I want Orcus!!!

Graz'zt got his book in Demonweb Pits!