(Discussion) General Part III

[Hof]

I think a focus is just another component, as verbal, somatic and material are different, so I don't think eshrew material would apply here. If you apply EM to Focus, what will happen, the priest will neever need there holy symbol to cast?

Hi people, thanks for the thoughts. But seeing as how I would like to play Dioran without ever having to use any material for his spells, would a feat such as the following be acceptable?

Eschew Arcane Focus (General)
Prerequisites: Eschew Materials.
Benefit: You can cast any arcane spell that has a focus costing 1 gp or less without needing that focus. (The casting of the spell still provokes attacks of opportunity as normal.) If the spell requires a focus that costs more than 1 gp, you must have the focus at hand to cast the spell, just as normal.

It circumvents the holy symbol problem by only applying to arcane spells. A little underpowered I feel, as I do not see anyone else being willing to spend a feat on this, but what do you think?

I had also thought about an 'improved Eschew materials' version which would slightly increase the maximum cost for ignored materials and include foci, but I saw no way to exclude holy symbols and mistletoe without sounding strained.


On an utterly off-topic note: how do I find the Id for a post? I had wished to link to dioran directly in my sig, but I can't find the postid, nor do I know how to link to the nth post in a thread.

Hof.

 

[Erekose13]

cant answer you about the feat proposal, but to link to a specific post you can find the id of the post by clicking on Edit Post. the number there is the one that you need. For your character here is the link you need: http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1199619

 

[Velmont]

Eshrew Arcane Focus can be rename Eshrew Focus and include the holy symbol. It is just combining A EMat with EFocus with Holy Symbol included would have been too strong, but as two separate feats it would be balance. Having Eshrew material as a pre requisit is a good idea too. So I suggest to add the Holy Symbol to the new feat, or maybe create two feats:

Eshrew Arcane Focus
Eshrew Divine Focus

 

[Thels]

I think Eshrew Focus would be fine with the holy symbol not included, if you assume a cleric needs his holy symbol to memorize spells. I'm not sure on the exact ruling on that. If a cleric doesn't need that, then he should need his holy symbol for all spells that say so, otherwise, you end up with clerics without holy symbol.

 

[GnomeWorks]

As a Gnomoholic, I am pro Scent.
Scent gets a yes from me.

The feat, though, is what I'm talking about. And what about non-gnomes and non-half-orcs getting it?

 

[dpdx]

I'd say Eschew Materials is fine for wizards, but not clerics. It just doesn't sound right to me - a cleric without a divine focus is just another worshipper. Besides, even a wooden holy symbol costs more than a gold.

If you did have to have an Eschew Divine Focus feat, I'd at least wait until the cleric was about sixth or thereabouts, or make it a Metamagic Feat you could take, like Focusless Spell, but with a balancing factor, like two spell levels; for example, your focusless Bless would take up a third-level spell slot.

 

[Thomas Hobbes]

I'd say Eschew Materials is fine for wizards, but not clerics. It just doesn't sound right to me - a cleric without a divine focus is just another worshipper. Besides, even a wooden holy symbol costs more than a gold.

If you did have to have an Eschew Divine Focus feat, I'd at least wait until the cleric was about sixth or thereabouts, or make it a Metamagic Feat you could take, like Focusless Spell, but with a balancing factor, like two spell levels; for example, your focusless Bless would take up a third-level spell slot.

The problem with that is that it is grossly underpowered- even silent spell and still spell (which let you cast when gagged, magically silenced, grappled, etc.) only eat up one level. Who is going to sacrifice two to do it without a holy symbol- a situation which, if it comes up at all, generally only happens after you also lose all your +1 etceteras, and thus are in much more trouble than that.

Hof originally asked wants someone who draws arcane power from his own soul, so this is basically a flavor feat, much like eschew materials, without much game use (your milage may vary). So for him, at least, the whole cleric-without-a-holy-symbol is a moot point. If someone actually wanted to try to do a cleric that way (perhaps worshipping no deity, with the power coming from himself), I think it would be interesting.

 

[dpdx]

I guess we agree, then - 'fine for wizards, not clerics.' I must have lost track of who wanted to apply it to clerics, and I responded to that.

Two levels (instead of one) was an example, not a concrete stipulation (besides, who am I, right?). I still don't like it for clerics, but I guess in Hof's case, that's moot. My cleric would feel naked without his holy symbol.

 

[Hof]

Ok, so should I make a (proposal) thread for the eschew arcane focus feat, which I expect will get hooted at for underpoweredness, or can I just add it to my character sheet?
Or
Seeing as how ignoring a holy symbol is a non-issue for me, do I even need a feat to bypass the foci? I've seen two differing oponions about this so I'm unsure.

The whole holy symbol/mistletoe problem is kind of tricky. The easiest solution, other than just not allowing foci to be ignored, is to up the cost for these things to 1 gold and 1 copper piece


Hof.

 

[dpdx]

If it were me, since it's Eschew Arcane Focus, I wouldn't even sweat trying to balance it for the clerics and druids. If they want a Eschew Divine Focus or whatever, let them propose the feat.