does anyone else think half-orcs get gypped?

[Enforcer]

fabulous.

oh, and for everyone who asked, let me reiterate: IMC, there's no such thing as half-orcs. just orcs. orcs that use the stats of half-orcs. so yes, full-blooded orcs would get the scent ability too... and probably the intimidate bonus.

That seems cool, but as mentioned be prepared for some Ranger-dipping. Not that that's a bad thing.

 

[Seeten]

Bunch of excuses for why a one-trick pony, whose one trick is the weakest build in the game, makes the race with unbalanced ability scores balanced

Guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Enforcer]

Indeed, though not without parting shots I see. :\

 

[Seeten]

If the race was -2 str, -2 dex - 2 con +2 wis +2 cha I'd agree it needed unbalanced ability scores, since it makes a great cleric, and clerics are godly.

Being a great fighter, not that I think they are, as stated previously, but even if they were a great fighter, does not deserve punishment. Fighters blow.

Sorry, I couldnt rest without getting more shots in. I'm a bad person.

 

[Klaus]

How about:

Empty headed: Half orcs have a +2 bonus against mind affecting spells and effects.

Abused: Can Take Die Hard feat without meeting prerequisite.

Kinslayer: +1 to hit orcs in melee

-These are human raised traits-

Labourer +50% carring capacity

Thrown down the well and came right back: +2 to swim and climb checks.

-These are orc raised traits-

Orcish leader: +2 to Leadership score if cohort and at least 50% of followers have orc blood.

Beast rider +2 to ride checks and handle animal on dire wolves [or other campaign specific orcish mount].

Nobody's bitch: +4 to on checks to escape grapple and break pins.

The pretty face: +3 on diplomacy checks with orcs, gnolls, gobliniods, minotaurs and non-good giants.

Y'know, those are awesome ideas!

YOINKED!

 

[Enforcer]

Fighters rule until about level 5, in my experience. But yeah, once the casters start getting the heavy artillery, they take the prize. I still think melee builds are important though--had a group that got to 13th in which the Fighter/Kensai was an absolute wrecking machine, even if he couldn't slay whole armies with a single cloudkill. With PHB II feats, I'm actually interested in playing a Human Fighter 1-20 though.

And you're not a bad person, you just got into an argument on the Internet. We're both probably sad people though.

Apologies to the OP, I'm leaving now. (I do think the Scent idea is cool though, as are frankthedm's suggestions).

 

[Seeten]

How about:

Empty headed: Half orcs have a +2 bonus against mind affecting spells and effects.

Abused: Can Take Die Hard feat without meeting prerequisite.

Kinslayer: +1 to hit orcs in melee

-These are human raised traits-

Labourer +50% carring capacity

Thrown down the well and came right back: +2 to swim and climb checks.

-These are orc raised traits-

Orcish leader: +2 to Leadership score if cohort and at least 50% of followers have orc blood.

Beast rider +2 to ride checks and handle animal on dire wolves [or other campaign specific orcish mount].

Nobody's bitch: +4 to on checks to escape grapple and break pins.

The pretty face: +3 on diplomacy checks with orcs, gnolls, gobliniods, minotaurs and non-good giants.

I frequently want to yell and scream at Frank's posts, but then he ups and posts incredible stuff, and I smile. *sigh*

 

[Grog]

I think Half-Orc Fighters are mediocre. They cant intimidate, they are worse than the worst fighter as unless they pump int they get 0 skill points, in short, they suck. As Barbarians they fare slightly better, as at least they get 2 skill points there.

Are you seriously using skill points as the criteria for determining how good a class is? No offense, but that's just silly. Except for rogues and maybe bards, skills just aren't that important for most classes. Most classes have one or two important skills that they'll max out (like Concentration and Spellcraft for casters), but beyond that, they're just gravy.

I mean, would anyone seriously argue that a 20th level bard was better than a 20th level sorceror because he has more skill points?

And anyway, a half-orc fighter gets 1 skill point per level, and a human fighter gets 2 (assuming neither one puts any points into Int). That's not really that big a difference.

 

[Plane Sailing]

would giving half-orcs (or full-blooded orcs in my campaign), the scent ability unbalance the race to the point of LA?

I think so. Check out scent

This extraordinary ability lets a creature detect approaching enemies, sniff out hidden foes, and track by sense of smell.

A creature with the scent ability can detect opponents by sense of smell, generally within 30 feet. If the opponent is upwind, the range is 60 feet. If it is downwind, the range is 15 feet. Strong scents, such as smoke or rotting garbage, can be detected at twice the ranges noted above. Overpowering scents, such as skunk musk or troglodyte stench, can be detected at three times these ranges.

The creature detects another creature’s presence but not its specific location. Noting the direction of the scent is a move action. If it moves within 5 feet of the scent’s source, the creature can pinpoint that source.

So, an ability that lets you pinpoint invisible foes that you are next to? Sounds amazingly strong to me. Especially including being aware of hidden foes within 15-60ft.

I don't allow high LA races, and I wouldn't allow a PC race with this kind of ability.

Cheers

 

[Seeten]

A human fighter can have combat expertise, improved trip, improved disarm, an entire feat chain of really nice tanking abilities with a 13 int. A Half-Orc has to drop a 15 in int just to learn the feats. Dunno about you, but those feats are pretty good.

Skills? They can matter. Sure.They are part of the whole. Half-Orcs dont get a bonus feat. They dont get bonus skill points, no bonus to saves, no bonus to skills, no crafting, no nothing. They get 2 strength, and thats it.

As I have already said, Strength is the best ability for fighters and barbs, and arguably arent even second best at either class. I'd play human first in BOTH cases. Further, Half-Orc's do nothing else, and fighter is the weakest class in the entire game. Skills are just a FURTHER slap in the face of the half-orc, that and the fact that halflings are MORE intimidating.