Immortals Handbook - Grimoire (Artifacts, Epic Magic discussion)

[Upper_Krust]

because he has a chronic need to redo every rule there is based on his knowledge of physics

Or lack of knowledge.

The problem is that AC is not an effective deterrent because its too easy to compromise at high level.

A 20th-level PC would be damaging the (AC 32) tank every hit. The tank doesn't really make a lot of sense like that.

But if we convert its natural armour to damage reduction, then it gives the PC something to think about.

The current damage reduction/hardness rules don't make golems very formidable opponents. Golems are the 'tanks' of the magical world. They should be helluva tough. DR 10 is a speed bump for an optimised fighter of teen levels, and thats assuming he doesn't already have an adamantine weapon or two.

 

[Farealmer3]

A tanks main gun is more powerful than a typical RPG.

I know it's more powerful but does it really need to be double? Why can't it be 9d10?

To determine its Natural Armour. Although it should really be 80 divided by 5.5 for 14.8.

Why is it 80? if your using object hp, than it would be 60, 40 for huge, 60 for gargantuan, 80 is colossal. And where are you getting the 5.5 from?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

I know it's more powerful but does it really need to be double? Why can't it be 9d10?

Thats like saying why does a rifle need to deal double (or whatever) the damage of a pistol. The energy output of the tank's gun must be x64 the RPG.

Why is it 80? if your using object hp, than it would be 60, 40 for huge, 60 for gargantuan, 80 is colossal. And where are you getting the 5.5 from?

I always get confused as to whether 30 is the bonus for medium or large. So if theres a mistake, its probably there.

 

[Farealmer3]

The energy output of the tank's gun must be x64 the RPG.

The question then becomes is a 120mm tank gun x64 greater than a 66mm LAW rocket propelled grenade?

Also do you use the x64=double damage for everthing or just explosives? I originally thought you only did it for nukes, i didn't know you used it for normal explosives as well. It makes sense though, since nukes are just large explosive devices.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy!

The question then becomes is a 120mm tank gun x64 greater than a 66mm LAW rocket propelled grenade?

I think it is.

Also do you use the x64=double damage for everthing or just explosives? I originally thought you only did it for nukes, i didn't know you used it for normal explosives as well. It makes sense though, since nukes are just large explosive devices.

Everything.

 

[Kerrick]

I can't recall what the final determination on the DDT vs. DDQ discussion was, but I stumbled across this earlier (it's from The Basics):

Sometimes a rule makes you multiply a number or a die roll. As long as you’re applying a single multiplier, multiply the number normally. When two or more multipliers apply to any abstract value (such as a modifier or a die roll), however, combine them into a single multiple, with each extra multiple adding 1 less than its value to the first multiple. Thus, a double (×2) and a double (×2) applied to the same number results in a triple (×3, because 2 + 1 = 3).

When applying multipliers to real-world values (such as weight or distance), normal rules of math apply instead. A creature whose size doubles (thus multiplying its weight by 8) and then is turned to stone (which would multiply its weight by a factor of roughly 3) now weighs about 24 times normal, not 10 times normal. Similarly, a blinded creature attempting to negotiate difficult terrain would count each square as 4 squares (doubling the cost twice, for a total multiplier of ×4), rather than as 3 squares (adding 100% twice).

By this rule, spell areas (which are measured in feet, a concrete value) would follow normal mathematical rules, not D&D rules. I already use this, but it's nice to have something to back me up.

 

[Farealmer3]

Hi U_K i got a question for you about a discrepancy amoung your work. According to you a x64 increase in energy doubles the damage. Since heat is it'self energy why don't you use it for heat as well?

Also by finding out the rough estimate of the energy output of big bang and comparing it to a 1 megaton bomb i got that the big bang total energy output converted to damage is 3,865,470,566,400. So why does the Big Bang heat damage greatly exceed the damage of it's entire energy output when that output would include heat?

 

[Omeganian]

Hi U_K i got a question for you about a discrepancy amoung your work. According to you a x64 increase in energy doubles the damage. Since heat is it'self energy why don't you use it for heat as well?

Also by finding out the rough estimate of the energy output of big bang and comparing it to a 1 megaton bomb i got that the big bang total energy output converted to damage is 3,865,470,566,400. So why does the Big Bang heat damage greatly exceed the damage of it's entire energy output when that output would include heat?

Well, the heat is the one given for when the entire energy is more or less concentrated in one place, ond not when it expands in an explosion. But I agree, the damage is off. A not too large asteroid's hit can deal more.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Farealmer matey!

Hi U_K i got a question for you about a discrepancy amoung your work. According to you a x64 increase in energy doubles the damage. Since heat is it'self energy why don't you use it for heat as well?

Who/what says I don't?

Also by finding out the rough estimate of the energy output of big bang and comparing it to a 1 megaton bomb i got that the big bang total energy output converted to damage is 3,865,470,566,400. So why does the Big Bang heat damage greatly exceed the damage of it's entire energy output when that output would include heat?

You'll have to run me through that equation step by step. Its probably been about 4 years since I worked out the Megaton damage.

 

[Omeganian]

BTW, there is one point about the Kiloton class spells. It is supposed to reflect nuclear weapons. If you will increase the amount of nuclear fuel thousandfold, you will not get a thousandfold increase in temperature, no more than with ordinary fire. You will NEVER get a Big Bang with hydrogen.