D&D (2024) Monks Are Not Tanks And Shouldn’t Be

[VenerableBede]

I think most people agree that the monk is a class that’s trying to do too much with too little, but one mistake that many people make in trying to improve the monk is making it tankier, trying to get the class to match up with fighter or barbarian. That’s not what the monk was ever intended to be—the monk is a skirmisher and striker, intended to move in, deal big damage, then run away. (Emphasize intended because it does need tweaking to fit this role better.)

Forget about AC and HP with the monk, for the most part. Speed and damage should be all that matter. A monk’s best defense is offense and mobility—killing enemies before the monk takes much damage, and getting well out of the range of attacks.

The monk’s increase to movement speed evidences this, as well as abilities like deflecting projectiles (for protection from ranged attacks). What the monk is lacking (that Step of the Wind tries and fails to fix because the monk’s discipline point pool is stretched too thin) is increased ability to disengage. There’s a reason so many people take Mobility for monks—the class is designed to excel by moving fast, hitting a lot, then running away and not being the target of opportunity attacks.

In my opinion, the “best” monk fixes would be as follows:

1. Any added or tweaked defensive abilities should focus on mobility or deflecting ranged attacks, not AC or HP
2. The monk by level 2 or 3 should not be able to be targeted by opportunity attacks from enemies it attacks with an unarmed strike or a simple weapon—the key part of Mobility that makes the monk really work
3. Extra attack (a third attack) at 11th level, and at some point Flurry of Blows no longer costing discipline

With these changes the monk can successfully fulfill its intended role, with less reliance on (the gutted) Stunning Strike. (Also allowing the monk to set save DCs for grappling/knocking prone with unarmed strikes using Dexterity or Wisdom would be helpful, but I’m just throwing that in as a bonus idea.)

This is not intended to be a comprehensive overhaul, but hopefully me pointing out stuff that’s obvious to most.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Eh I think it’s really iconic for the monk to not get hit, even when mobility fails, and also to be able to stay n the mix for a couple rounds.

They don’t need higher HP, but better AC and damage mitigation, yea.

They also should get a jump distance boost with Unarmored movement, and maybe bonus movement any time they are missed with an attack or take no damage from a saving throw.

 

[mellored]

Eh I think it’s really iconic for the monk to not get hit, even when mobility fails, and also to be able to stay n the mix for a couple rounds.

They don’t need higher HP, but better AC and damage mitigation, yea.

They also should get a jump distance boost with Unarmored movement, and maybe bonus movement any time they are missed with an attack or take no damage from a saving throw.

Mobile Defense:
As a reaction, when you take damage, you can spend 1 ki to move half your unarmored movement bonus, without provoking opportunity attacks. Reduce the damage by the distance you moved.

 

[Greg K]

I think there should be a tanky variant (e.g. iron body monks) included similar to how the cleric and druid have variants available at first level given that there are examples of big tough monks in kung fu and wuxia cinema that soak damage from punches and kicks.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Mobile Defense:
As a reaction, when you take damage, you can spend 1 ki to move half your unarmored movement bonus, without provoking opportunity attacks. Reduce the damage by the distance you moved.

I’d rather it not use a reaction, and be integrated into existing defensive abilities, tbh. The monk has so many things going on.

 

[Clint_L]

Yeah, I think a tanky monk sub-class would fit very well with the popular conception of the martial artist - almost every martial arts film has at least one such fighter, after all.

But I also agree that the core class should not be as tanky as a fighter, paladin, or barbarian. Which is why I think the suggestion of moving patient defence to work off a reaction is such a great idea - it lets monks survive in melee for a round or two without having them become damage sponges, while leaving their bonus action open for offence or mobility, which are their big things.

 

[Vael]

Honestly, the reason I want d10 for the Monk is it still a combatant that has to wade into melee ... or should we downgrade the Ranger's hitdice to d8s as well?

 

[mellored]

Stances?

As a bonus action, you enter a stance. You can only have one stance active at a time.

Iron stance: you gain resistance to all damage. Your speed is halved.

Flurry stance: once on your turn, you can an Unarmed attack without taking an action. If you don't make the attack the stance ends.

Step of the wind stance: increase your movement speed by 20'. Your movement does not trigger reactions.

Elemental stance (subclass): increase your Unarmed reach by 10'. You gain an aura...

Level 5/11/17: you can have 2/3/4 stances at once.

 

[billd91]

I think there should be a tanky variant (e.g. iron body monks) included similar to how the cleric and druid have variants available at first level given that there are examples of big tough monks in kung fu and wuxia cinema that soak damage from punches and kicks.

Yes, and I’d allow them to swap Strength for their attacks and AC bonus instead of Dexterity. I keep thinking of the mantis style from the movie Invincible Shaolin.

 

[Valetudo]

The core monk class needs a d10 hitdice. Among other things. Im not asking for damage resist and armor proficiencies. But it definately needs a d10, nothing is going to change that for me.