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[Spartan_MD]

@Salthorae Obtaining two weapon fighting via 1 level of fighter will give that off hand weapon +7 damage.

 

[FrogReaver]

@Salthorae Obtaining two weapon fighting via 1 level of fighter will give that off hand weapon +7 damage.

To put this in perspective:

Current DPR with shield = 14.4
Current DPR with TWF (no style) = 19.8
DPR with TWF style = 22.8
DPR with Reckless attack while TWF (no style) = 25
DPR with reckless attack and TWF style = 29.2
DPR with reckless attack and extra attack while TWF (no style) = 35.3

***Assuming 65% chance to hit with your +1 sword

In short, dualwielding with no style adds alot of damage. If the choice is between Fighter 1 and Barb 2 you should choose Barb 2 for reckless attack.

Once you have barb 2 you are doing 25 damage. I would be more concerned about defense at that point - which means either bear totem barbarian or rogue evasion would be my next goal.

Now the decision tree starts getting more complex, but if you actually compare your options you'll find Barbarian 5 is a better path to getting damage than fighter 1 (only takes 2 more levels from level 3). Rogue X continues to scale damage (slighly behind fighter 1) but also adds many additional perks.

So IMO, fighter 1 is a waste.

 

[FrogReaver]

Also of particular not is there will be rounds you don't have a bonus action to attack with. Putting levels into making a bonus attack better that you won't even use every round seems bad.

For example. The first turn of your encounter you will typically rage. Rage takes a bonus action. No bonus action attack here.

During the middle of combat there will be turns where you might want to dash or disengage. Your rogue can do that as a bonus action.

In short, focusing on a bonus action that you won't use every round doesn't seem like the best use of your levels. IMO

 

[RogueJK]

Also, at Rogue 6 you could/should pick up Athletics Expertise, which combined with your high Strength and Advantage on Strength checks while Raging, makes you a beast at Grappling/Shoving.

Grapple + Shove Prone (or Grapple on an already prone enemy) = enemy cannot stand up = automatic Advantage and Sneak Attacks on melee attacks against that target, without having to use Reckless Attack and absorbing additional attacks yourself.

However, grappling/shoving requires a free hand. So grappling is another scenario in which you won't be able to utilize TWF style.

(Granted, it's a bit Action-intensive, but there are ways to deal with that, such as Extra Attack and/or feats like Shield Master and Tavern Brawler.)

 

[Esker]

To put this in perspective:

Current DPR with shield = 14.4
Current DPR with TWF (no style) = 19.8
DPR with TWF style = 22.8
DPR with Reckless attack while TWF (no style) = 25
DPR with reckless attack and TWF style = 29.2
DPR with reckless attack and extra attack while TWF (no style) = 35.3

***Assuming 65% chance to hit with your +1 sword

Useful perspective!

Just for clarification, is this all based on his current strength and sneak attack damage? And assuming rage is active and granting a bonus based on whether barb 5 is assumed?

Would be useful to look at level 10 (the earliest he could get extra attack), and compare, say, Barb 2 / Rogue 8 to Barb 5 / Rogue 5, with and without TWF. I would look at expected DPR over 6 fights of 3 rounds each, assuming rage uses a bonus action on the first round however many fights you have rages. I would be inclined to look at Sentinel and assume a reaction attack something like 25% of the time.

(I'll do this myself when I get a chance, but am on mobile now, so will be a bit)

I expect extra attack will still come out ahead, but will be worth less than 10 DPR.

 

[FrogReaver]

Useful perspective!

Just for clarification, is this all based on his current strength and sneak attack damage? And assuming rage is active and granting a bonus based on whether barb 5 is assumed?

Would be useful to look at level 10 (the earliest he could get extra attack), and compare, say, Barb 2 / Rogue 8 to Barb 5 / Rogue 5, with and without TWF. I would look at expected DPR over 6 fights of 3 rounds each, assuming rage uses a bonus action on the first round however many fights you have rages. I would be inclined to look at Sentinel and assume a reaction attack something like 25% of the time.

(I'll do this myself when I get a chance, but am on mobile now, so will be a bit)

I expect extra attack will still come out ahead, but will be worth less than 10 DPR.

I'm not sure his current Str.
I assume:
20 Str
Rage is active bonus damage applies to all attacks.
2nd sword is non-magical
Sneak attack damage of 10.5

Chance to hit is 87.75% for magic weapon short sword attack. Damage on that attack is 11.5 based on above assumptions. Comes in just over 10 DPR.

Also, I've ignored crits in this analysis for simplicity.

 

[FrogReaver]

Useful perspective!

Just for clarification, is this all based on his current strength and sneak attack damage? And assuming rage is active and granting a bonus based on whether barb 5 is assumed?

Would be useful to look at level 10 (the earliest he could get extra attack), and compare, say, Barb 2 / Rogue 8 to Barb 5 / Rogue 5, with and without TWF. I would look at expected DPR over 6 fights of 3 rounds each, assuming rage uses a bonus action on the first round however many fights you have rages. I would be inclined to look at Sentinel and assume a reaction attack something like 25% of the time.

(I'll do this myself when I get a chance, but am on mobile now, so will be a bit)

I expect extra attack will still come out ahead, but will be worth less than 10 DPR.

One other thing to mention, If you aren't wanting bear totem barbarian then zealot path barbarian adds an extra rage per day and a little more damage than a level of rogue giving +1d6 sneak attack.

 

[FrogReaver]

I would look at expected DPR over 6 fights of 3 rounds each, assuming rage uses a bonus action on the first round however many fights you have rages.

In my games we have 1-2 combats per day and on rare occasion will have 3. Based on the feedback I've seen here I think that matches up a little closer to most campaigns than 6 encounters per day.

 

[FrogReaver]

Also, at Rogue 6 you could/should pick up Athletics Expertise, which combined with your high Strength and Advantage on Strength checks while Raging, makes you a beast at Grappling/Shoving.

Grapple + Shove Prone (or Grapple on an already prone enemy) = enemy cannot stand up = automatic Advantage and Sneak Attacks on melee attacks against that target, without having to use Reckless Attack and absorbing additional attacks yourself.

However, grappling/shoving requires a free hand. So grappling is another scenario in which you won't be able to utilize TWF style.

(Granted, it's a bit Action-intensive, but there are ways to deal with that, such as Extra Attack and/or feats like Shield Master and Tavern Brawler.)

Extra attack is really good for this tactic - you can grapple and attack in the same turn. The free hand issue is still there, but it's easy enough to sheath your offhand weapon when you want to attempt this and pull it out on the turn the grapple is broken.

 

[FrogReaver]

I would be inclined to look at Sentinel and assume a reaction attack something like 25% of the time.

I think 25% there is fair. I tend to find that sentinel has a bigger effect on the amount of time you get attacked though. What this means is that you will likely not go all out reckless attacking which in turn mitigates a lot of the "additional" damage you do with sentinel.

That said it still has it's place for the tanking aspect - which probably helps the team more than it's DPR contribution, but it's actual impact on DPR is going to be much harder to estimate.