Sorceror eats Favoured Soul

[The Shadow]

Very interesting!

Now, does this mean that different sorcerers will have different spell lists? I think it almost has to - the draconic sorcerer list just doesn't seem to match up to some of the other origins we're hearing about. I would certainly expect a divine "sorcerer" to be capable of at least some minor healing, for example.

The name 'sorcerer' seems rather odd for this collection of classes now. And that's what it is - when the hit die, proficiencies, and indeed just about everything but Willpower change with origin, they're basically distinct classes. What other name could be used, though? I suspect that 'sorcerers' will often be identified by their origin rather than their official class.

I like the idea of specificity in pacts, provided they give us lots of guidance in making our own. I mean, the Verenestra pact is cool, but it's far from the only type of fey pact I can imagine.

(Also: A pact with the githyanki lich-queen?! How awesome is that?! Answer: Really, really awesome! At least if they do it remotely right.)

 

[DEFCON 1]

I wonder how many people will cast everything just so they can reap the benefits of their partial transformations.

Who knows maybe it won't be so bad, maybe.

I have a hard time believing that the abilities gained once willpower was depleted would be so much better than the sorcerer's spells that he'd actually "mana dump" (for lack of a better term) all his spells just to get there.

The partial transformation abilities seem to me to be more like "consolation prizes" for the PCs since they will most likely have substantially less "spell slot" willpower than regular Clerics and Wizards would.

 

[Li Shenron]

The Favoured Soul was put to be the Sorceror for the Cleric.

Considering that the original 3ed Sorcerer was just an excuse class to try out a variant spellcasting system and the FS just the application of the same variant to the Cleric, and considering that probably ALL the 5e spellcaster classes are going to have different spellcasting rules anyway, there really is no reason have FS as a separate class in 5e.

Should they have one more idea for a spellcasting variant, if they are in need of a class to stitch it on and decide to call it the Favored Soul, I'm not going to be against it... but there is no need to reason the other way around (i.e. no need to allocate design working time for another spellcasting variant just to be able to apply the Favoured Soul label to one additional class).

 

[Kobold Avenger]

In this particular case... a "divine Sorcerer" would basically be the equivalent to the 3E Favored Soul and the 4E Invoker.

I never saw the Invoker as a Divine Sorcerer, I've always seen them as a Divine Wizard that ate the 3e Truenamer.

 

[tlantl]

Then again the description of the sorcerer allows the sorcerer to use their will power points to feed their bloodline powers directly so the problem isn't as likely to manifest as I first suggested since it seems to be the intent of the class. I would gladly waste will points to gain the Dragon scales protection from energy the bloodline bestows. it's probably a good thing you need to waste all of your point at 4th level to manifest this power. This won't be an issue at eighth or tenth levels, though.

I for see a lot of sorcerers using up their will power points on their bloodlines rather than spells. Maybe that's not such a bad thing though.

My real issue with the class is how easily they will be able to consistently rely on their highest level spells by not using will points to feed their lower level ones. That's eight castings of acid arrow at fifth level as compared to the wizard's 3 and what happens at 6th level when the sorcerer gets his 3rd level spells and their will points reach 20 or more, does that mean six or seven fireballs to the wizard's three?

I'm not entirely convinced this would actually happen but my nephew and youngest brother will definitely go for the potential to maximize when ever possible and having this available would be a no brainer for them. It's the way they play and it tends to be disruptive in a group where other strategies are preferred. They wind up dead a lot too.

 

[Aexalon]

If only they'd take that sort of reasoning to its natural conclusion: the merging of the wizard and the cleric.

or, a bit more elaborate:

• the splitting of the cleric into a holy warrior and a priest
• the merging of the priest with the wizard
• the merging of the holy warrior and insert-favourite-arcane-gish-class-here

It'll never happen, of course, given their *apparent* aversion of any actual innovation in Next.

 

[gyor]

I wonder if the favoured soul sorcerors will gain channel divinity or a something akin to that.

Favoured has a tiny bit of flavour in common with invoker, but not much. Even before Favoured Soul became a pp of Avenger, most people focused on using the Favoured Soul as a magically buffed fighter (although you could make an awesome summoner, especially if you took levels in Malconvoker which would have a bit more in common with a Invoker).

The Favoured Soul got fighter feats and latter wings and engery resistances so I wouldn't be surprised to see those again or an, approximation such as automatic prof in your deities weapons and later wings. This fits well with thier ideas for the sorceror.

I kind of hope thiers the kind of flexiblity that the dragon sorceror has with the Ability to choose the the type of dragon origin aka Blue, Gold, Copper. Maybe planar or alignment? deity beyond favoured weapon might be challenging.

Shadowcaster from 3.5 might fit as well, although the casting mechanics wouldn't.

 

[tuxgeo]

I never saw the Invoker as a Divine Sorcerer, I've always seen them as a Divine Wizard that ate the 3e Truenamer.

Yeah, WotC made that pretty explicit -- the Invoker has the "Controller" role, and can take multi-target At-Will powers at Level 1: Astral Wind (blast 3), Grasping Shards (burst 1 in 10), Hand of Radiance (target 1 - 3 beings), Vanguard's Lightning (burst 1 in 10), and Visions of Blood (blast 3).

 

[Dragonhelm]

The Favoured Soul was put to be the Sorceror for the Cleric.

The mystic from the Dragonlance Campaign Setting predates the Favored Soul. It was a "divine sorcerer" of sorts, with spells known and a single domain (where domain spells were added to spells known). It was a neat class, though underpowered compared to the cleric. Mechanically speaking, the favored soul turned out to be a better divine sorcerer.

In Dragonlance lore, the sorcerer and mystic predated the D&D 3e rules. They were a part of the SAGA rules system. During those years, the sorcerer and mystic were described as being two sides of the same coin, with mystics having the magic of life and sorcerers having the power of elemental and creative power.

When the DLCS came out, WotC mandated that the sorcerer be the PHB sorcerer. Likewise, the mystic would be a variant cleric.

With the way sorcerers are going in Next, I could see the single class being used for both sorcerer and mystic, giving credence once again to the idea of them being two sides to the same coin.

That being said, I have often thought that the two classes should be distinct and have their own flavor. So I'm not sure how that will work out in 5e.

 

[gyor]

I wonder if the favoured soul sorcerors will gain channel divinity or a something akin to that.

Favoured has a tiny bit of flavour in common with invoker, but not much. Even before Favoured Soul became a pp of Avenger, most people focused on using the Favoured Soul as a magically buffed fighter (although you could make an awesome summoner, especially if you took levels in Malconvoker which would have a bit more in common with a Invoker).

The Favoured Soul got fighter feats and latter wings and engery resistances so I wouldn't be surprised to see those again or an, approximation such as automatic prof in your deities weapons and later wings. This fits well with thier ideas for the sorceror.

I kind of hope thiers the kind of flexiblity that the dragon sorceror has with the Ability to choose the the type of dragon origin aka Blue, Gold, Copper. Maybe planar or alignment? deity beyond favoured weapon might be challenging.

Shadowcaster from 3.5 might fit as well, although the casting mechanics wouldn't.