TORCHWOOD Finale - spoilers

Raven Crowking

First Post
Cthulhudrew said:
The whole 12 regeneration thing could possibly be just a Time Lord edict, some ancient rule laid down by them to keep order among their kind.


Nah. The Twin Dilemna (6th Doctor) tells us that a Time Lord can force a thirteenth regeneration, but it is invariably fatal. In fact, this trick is used to slay the BBEG.

As you say, the Master has circumvented the rule by being a body thief, but he has required an enormous energy source to steal the body of Consul Tremas (The Keeper of Traken, 4th Doctor). In the TV Movie (8th Doctor), the protoplasmic Master (which I theorize is a Dalek construct) can possess a human body, but the body immediately begins to degrade. It's hard to imagine the Doctor accepting either of these solutions.

The Time Lords did offer the Master a whole new cycle of regenerations, though, in The Five Doctors, so there must be a way to get around this.

(I theorize that the Valeyard is actually a construct created by the Matrix on Gallifrey, an amalgamation of the Doctor's evil in potential futures predicted by the Matrix, but not necessarily required to come to pass. This because, in Trial of a Time Lord, it is clearly shown that the Matrix has become a "real" place with alternate laws of physics, that physical beings can enter and leave. Since the energy created in the Matrix would be real when projected through the viewscreen, one could posit that a creature created in the Matrix could be made real if it left the Matrix. Not unlike the Plasmatons and Gel Guards created by Omega's will. I would also guess that the Mel the 6th Doctor left the Trial with was a similar construct, or else he would certainly be worried about temporal anomolies.)
 

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Raven Crowking

First Post
meomwt said:
In the same story, we saw a decayed and dying Master who had used all of his regenerations. His plan was to harness the Time Lords' power source (The Eye of Harmony, a black hole balanced against the mass of their planet) to give himself more regenerations. The Doctor managed to work out what was happening and put a stop to it.

Correction: The Master lured the 4th Doctor to Gallifrey. His plan was to use the energy of the Eye of Harmony to steal the Doctor's body....Just like in the TV Movie.

As regards what will happen when The Doctor hits his thirteenth regeneration? Who knows! Suffice to say, if the series is still pulling in viewers and making money through merchandising, there'll be a conveniant narrative reason why the limit is removed (effect of being last Time Lord, special radiation, etc.).

They might say that the Time Energy he took from Rose was enough to give him a new cycle of regenerations. I actually thought it would be nice if, at the end of Series 1, it was Rose who regenerated, instead of the Doctor! :lol:
 

Lorgrom

First Post
Mark Hope said:
12 regenerations, 13 lives. We're on life #10 now, so three more to go. Unless, of course, there is some jiggery-pokery in the offing. It wouldn't be the first time...

They all ready did add in an easy scape-goat for this. When Rose was going to be killed due to absorbing/combining with the TARDIS. The Doctor took all that power from her and said something akin to "I have absorbed all the powers of the Time Lords". So they could possibly use that as a way to give him near infinate lives (12 regenerations per Time Lord that could have ever existed?).
 

Mark Hope

Adventurer
Raven Crowking said:
(I theorize that the Valeyard is actually a construct created by the Matrix on Gallifrey, an amalgamation of the Doctor's evil in potential futures predicted by the Matrix, but not necessarily required to come to pass. This because, in Trial of a Time Lord, it is clearly shown that the Matrix has become a "real" place with alternate laws of physics, that physical beings can enter and leave. Since the energy created in the Matrix would be real when projected through the viewscreen, one could posit that a creature created in the Matrix could be made real if it left the Matrix. Not unlike the Plasmatons and Gel Guards created by Omega's will. I would also guess that the Mel the 6th Doctor left the Trial with was a similar construct, or else he would certainly be worried about temporal anomolies.)
Seems like a pretty sound theory to me :). I do like the idea of the Doctor having an Evil Incarnation, but I'm also of the opinion that the Valeyard was an expression of potential, rather than an actual incarnation.

Lorgrom said:
They all ready did add in an easy scape-goat for this. When Rose was going to be killed due to absorbing/combining with the TARDIS. The Doctor took all that power from her and said something akin to "I have absorbed all the powers of the Time Lords". So they could possibly use that as a way to give him near infinate lives (12 regenerations per Time Lord that could have ever existed?).
That would be very cool indeed - a nice, easy out, and one that connects back to the whole Eye of Harmony thing (or whatever the Heart of the Tardis actually is these days).

It's one of the things I like the most about the new Dr Who episodes - the writers/producers clearly have a great deal of respect for continuity and the old stories. They're managing to spin a new series of tales without trampling over the old stuff. Good show, chaps :)...
 

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