UA Generic Classes--Questions, Comments, NPCs, Prestige?

[Particle_Man]

This is fun! Meet Twang - Devout follower of Ehlonna:

Twang: Generic Expert1; Medium Human (5 ft.6in. tall); HD1d6+1; hp 7; Init +2 (dex +2); Spd 30 ft.; AC 15 (studded-leather +3, +2 dex); Atks +1 melee (1d4+1, dagger) or +2 ranged (1d8+1, Mighty Composite Longbow); SV Fort +3, Ref +4, Will +3; Str 12, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8. Skills: Disguise +3, Listen +7, Knowledge (religion) +4, Ride +6, Spot +7 Survival +7. Feats: All simple weapons, longbow, light armor, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot. Special Features: Turn Undead.

Oh yes, I forgot. She is a woman.

Oops. I just noticed. As written, the turn undead feat requires that one take at least one level in spellcaster (divine). So with pure expert, you would need to house rule it or change the feat/special feature. You could get smite evil, though.

 

[Particle_Man]

What have we here then? Yes. it's Celsius. An accomplished alchemist with a penchant for temper tantrums to say the least.

Celsius: Generic Spellcaster1; Medium Human (5 ft.10in. tall); HD1d4+1; hp 5; Init +2 (dex +2); Spd 30 ft.; AC 12 (+2 large wooden shield*); Atks -1 melee (1d6-1, quarterstaff) or +0 ranged (1d6, acid flask); SV Fort +1, Ref +0, Will +4; Str 8, Dex 10, Con 12, Int 16, Wis 14, Cha 13. Skills: Craft (Alchemy) +10, Gather Information +5, Knowledge (Arcane) +7, Knowledge (Nature) +7, Spellcraft +7. Feats: Quarterstaff, Skill Focus (Alchemy), Shield. Special Features: Rage. *The shield doubles as a makeshift table. Spells: Celsius casts arcane spells with Intelligence.
0: Acid Splash, Light, Mage Hand, Read Magic
1: Cure Light Wounds, True Strike

Uh...quarterstaff and shield? Well, ok, as long as you don't use them in combat together.

 

[Frostmarrow]

If you have masterwork longsword, you might as well have masterwork studded leather and get rid of that pesky armor check penalty. Or get a masterwork mithral shirt and increase the ac w/o increasing your armor check penalty. Your call. Also, you get no automatic tower shield proficiency, if that matters.

Oh, and since you are human, you have 4 free skill points to burn. I would suggest tumble, since that seems to be what you wanted to go for (this is why I think the expert is a bit underpowered -- you can do a lot with warrior. On the other hand, the expert does get an extra good save and 4 more maximizable skills, at the cost of hit points, BAB, less feats later on, and weapon proficiencies (but your above guy would be ok with longsword)). Alternatively, you could change the race, but that would cost you one of your feats. Note: Sneak Attack is just a feat, not a special feature, on the generics system.

I LOVE the generics. I don't mind trading in a little power for the feat, skill and (for spellcaster) spell choice flexibility.

So it boils down to this:

Sneaky Clamor with an Edge: Generic Warrior1; Medium Human (6 ft.1 in. tall); HD1d10+1; hp 11; Init +6 (dex +2, Improved Initiative +4); Spd 30 ft.; AC 15 (+3 masterwork studded-leather, +2 dex); Atks +5 melee (1d8+3, masterwork longsword) or +3 ranged (1d4+3, dagger); SV Fort +1, Ref +4, Will +1; Str 16, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8. Skills: Hide +8, Move Silently +8, Tumble +6. Feats: All simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor, shields, Stealthy, Improved Initiative. Special Features: Sneak Attack +2d6.

Perhaps the Expert can pick Rogue special abilities (you know opportunist and skill mastery) at higher levels? Maybe that would help evening the field. So far, I'm more worried about the spellcaster. It seems a bit bland. Maybe one needs to add some fluff to ones spellcaster concept?

I just put down Sneak Attack as a Special Feature to make the difference between regular classes and generic ones stand out.

It really is a shame that SA can be used with any melee weapon because this is bound to be taken advantage of. Just have Clamor above change his weapon to a greatsword and all fun is gone. IMC SA will be for medium weapons or smaller.

 

[Frostmarrow]

Oops. I just noticed. As written, the turn undead feat requires that one take at least one level in spellcaster (divine). So with pure expert, you would need to house rule it or change the feat/special feature. You could get smite evil, though.

Yes! Smite is cool.

 

[Frostmarrow]

Uh...quarterstaff and shield? Well, ok, as long as you don't use them in combat together.

The staff is for walking and the shield is a makeshift table for the times you must mix together some acid in the field.

 

[Frostmarrow]

Twang Pow: Generic Expert1; Medium Human (5 ft.6in. tall); HD1d6+1; hp 7; Init +2 (dex +2); Spd 30 ft.; AC 15 (studded-leather +3, +2 dex); Atks +2 melee (1d8+1, masterwork spear) or +2 ranged (1d8+1, Mighty Composite Longbow); SV Fort +3, Ref +4, Will +3; Str 12, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8. Skills: Disguise +3, Handle Animal: +3, Listen +7, Knowledge (religion) +4, Ride +6, Spot +7 Survival +7. Feats: All simple weapons, longbow, light armor, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot. Special Features: Smite Evil.

 

[Frostmarrow]

Degrees Celsius: Generic Spellcaster1; Medium Human (5 ft.10in. tall); HD1d4+1; hp 5; Init +2 (dex +2); Spd 30 ft.; AC 12 (+2 large wooden shield*); Atks -1 melee (1d6-1, quarterstaff) or +0 ranged (1d6, acid flask); SV Fort +1, Ref +0, Will +4; Str 8, Dex 10, Con 12, Int 16, Wis 14, Cha 13. Skills: Craft (Alchemy) +10, Diplomacy +5, Gather Information +5, Knowledge (Arcane) +7, Knowledge (Nature) +7, Spellcraft +7. Feats: Quarterstaff, Skill Focus (Alchemy), Shield. Special Features: Rage. *The shield doubles as a makeshift table. Spells: Celsius casts arcane spells with Intelligence.
0: Acid Splash, Light, Mage Hand, Read Magic
1: Cure Light Wounds, True Strike

 

[Storminator]

So this is basically legal? Good thing that Hide and Move Silently prereq as it makes it harder for a Warrior to combine Sneak Attack with Tumble.

With the generics you can choose your class skills. Warriors get 6 class skills. Just take Hide, Move Silent and Tumble. (and Spot and Listen...)

PS

 

[Particle_Man]

So it boils down to this:

Sneaky Clamor with an Edge: Generic Warrior1; Medium Human (6 ft.1 in. tall); HD1d10+1; hp 11; Init +6 (dex +2, Improved Initiative +4); Spd 30 ft.; AC 15 (+3 masterwork studded-leather, +2 dex); Atks +5 melee (1d8+3, masterwork longsword) or +3 ranged (1d4+3, dagger); SV Fort +1, Ref +4, Will +1; Str 16, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8. Skills: Hide +8, Move Silently +8, Tumble +7. Feats: All simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor, shields, Stealthy, Improved Initiative. Special Features: Sneak Attack +2d6.

Perhaps the Expert can pick Rogue special abilities (you know opportunist and skill mastery) at higher levels? Maybe that would help evening the field. So far, I'm more worried about the spellcaster. It seems a bit bland. Maybe one needs to add some fluff to ones spellcaster concept?

I think that Tumble should only be +6 (4 ranks + 2 from dex bonus) unless I am missing something.

Dare I say it...Expert got the shaft! But yes, adding some feats that require expert levels as a prereq. would help. Or bumping up the skill point total.

I think the Spellcaster is ok. Think of it as a sorceror who gets a wider field from which to choose spells known, a feat every 5 levels, and the ability to swap out a familiar for a feat at 1st level, at the cost of many weapon proficiencies and a few spells per day. As for blandness...well, they are generic. The flavour has to come from you. So fluff is player-directed, yes. But I think that goes for all of them, to some extent. Personally I like the idea of a "Guard" - A human warrior with 8 int but who has spot and listen as class skills, and whose first three feats are Alertness, Skill focus (spot), and Skill focus (listen). Not much gets by Fred the Guard!

 

[Frostmarrow]

I think that Tumble should only be +6 (4 ranks + 2 from dex bonus) unless I am missing something.

Dare I say it...Expert got the shaft! But yes, adding some feats that require expert levels as a prereq. would help. Or bumping up the skill point total.

I think the Spellcaster is ok. Think of it as a sorceror who gets a wider field from which to choose spells known, a feat every 5 levels, and the ability to swap out a familiar for a feat at 1st level, at the cost of many weapon proficiencies and a few spells per day. As for blandness...well, they are generic. The flavour has to come from you. So fluff is player-directed, yes. But I think that goes for all of them, to some extent. Personally I like the idea of a "Guard" - A human warrior with 8 int but who has spot and listen as class skills, and whose first three feats are Alertness, Skill focus (spot), and Skill focus (listen). Not much gets by Fred the Guard!

I've been thinking along those lines lately. The cool thing about the generics is that you can introduce your character to your friends and include your cool title. And they still have no idea what your schtick is! The title you chose for your character should be selected carefully though as it can speak volumes about the character (not the stats). For example:

Elemental Dervish

Ilian Celsius: Generic Spellcaster2/Warrior1; Medium Human (5 ft.10in.
tall); HD2d4+1d10+6; hp 18; Init +2 (dex +2); Spd 30 ft.; AC 14 (+2 dex, +1
Two Weapon Defense); Atks +2/+2 melee (1d6, scimitar; 1d4, dagger) or +4
ranged (1d4, dagger); SV Fort +3, Ref +3, Will +3; Str 10, Dex 15, Con 14,
Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 12. Skills: Concentration +8, Diplomacy +7, Gather
Information +7, Knowledge (Royalty and Nobility) +9, Spellcraft +9, Tumble
+8. Feats: All simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor and
shields, Dodge, Finesse, Two Weapon Defense, Two Weapon Fighting. Spells:
Celsius casts arcane spells with Intelligence.
0: ACID SPLASH, CREATE WATER, FLARE, LIGHT.
1: BURNING HANDS, OBSCURING MIST, PRODUCE FLAME, RESIST ENERGY.

Future spells picked from the following:
0: Arcane Mark, Daze, Dancing Lights, Detect
Magic, Mage Hand, Mending, Message, Open/Close,
Prestidigitation, Read Magic, Resistance.
1: Magic Stone.
2: Flame Blade, Fire Trap, Flaming Sphere, Fog Cloud, Gust of Wind, Heat
Metal, Soften Earth and Stone, Scorching Ray, Whispering Wind, Wind Wall.
3: Fireball, Flame Arrow, Gaseous Form, Meld into Stone, Stone Shape,
Summon Small Elemental, Water Breathing, Water Walk.
4: Air walk, Control Water, Fire Shield, Spike Stones, Stoneskin, Wall of
Fire.
5: Control Winds, Summon Medium Elemental, Transmute Mud to Rock, Transmute
Rock to Mud, Wall of Stone.
6: Acid Fog, Fire Seeds, Move Earth, Summon Large Elemental, Wind Walk.
7: Delayed Blast Fireball, Earthquake, Fire Storm, Summon Huge Elemental.
8: Horrid Wilting, Incendiary Cloud, Ironbody, Repel Metal or Stone,
Whirlwind, Summon Greater Elemental.
9: Meteor Swarm, Elemental Swarm, Summon Elder Elemental.

Expert getting the shaft? I don't know yet.