D&D (2024) Warlock

[doctorbadwolf]

Soon, we will almost certainly see the Druid and Paladin, but after that, we will either see the Mages or the Warriors. I'm hoping for Mages, because I think they are going to be the most changed of the PHB classes.

Which brings me to my favorite mage, the Warlock.

We know that subclass is coming in at third level even for classes that currently get them earlier, with something else coming in at that earlier level.

I think that we will see level 1 Pact Boon, and level 3 Patron, and I hope that this will mean that the class feels a little more focused on the pact boon, ie how the character uses their power, than on the patron. If we are very lucky, they might even add in a pact of the rod or stave, cauldron or chalice, and perhaps something like a lantern or candle? Ritual tools, in other words.

What changes do we think might come to existing mechanics, keeping in mind they aren't going to invalidate anything in xanathar's or tasha's, unless it's easy to errata like when they reprinted Bladesinger in Tasha's.

I think we might see Chain changed to give a familiar that has a summon spell style statblock rather than reference statblocks in the MM. I wish we could see Blade changed to simply change one warlock cantrip of your choice or eldritch blast specifically into a melee spell attack using the reach and properties of your pact weapon, and just not update the invocation that gives extra attack. It still allows Hexblade to be an even better gish, as it gets medium armor, shields, and makes it's attacks with the attack action, just update it to give extra attack.

Tome is perfect as it is. I love a Hexblade Tome Warlock. You're fully dependent on the weapon cantrips, but that's fine because you're awesome.

I think they will change some of the invocations from 1/LR using a spell slot to just 1/LR.

What do y'all think?

 

[Yaarel]

A rod (or cane or staff) is a symbol of authority, perhaps especially because it is a tool of punishment.

Some shamanic customs use the cane to focus concentration on punishing a troublesome nature being.

Perhaps the Warlock Rod Pact can deal psychic damage to a target, including an extraplanar creature that is in the Border Ethereal or Astral Wildspace, or in the Material Plane if attacking from the Ethereal or Astral.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I think it is likely that the pact boons will be like cleric's holy order, you get one at 2 and another at 9, maybe even a third one via epic boon at 20. I could see some more boons, personally I would like a pact music instrument. I have doubts about it happening in the PHB, though.

The arcane spell list (as opposed to the warlock spell list) reduces the value of invocations that let you cast spells. I think most of the "cast a spell using a spell slot" invocation will be to add 6th level or higher primal or divine spells to your list (you will get 1-5 from the patron lists). That leaves a lot of space for pact boon support invocations at lower levels.

Given the "not useful in combat"/"too powerful out of combat" view that seems fairly common on the chainlock, I think there is potential for changing the chainlock by stealing the hexblade's minion. You get a combat minion that you can power up by disposing of an enemy (dedicating it to your patron; my design goal for the warlock is that your PC may be a good person, but he/she is still using BAD guy toys to do it).

 

[Yaarel]

When converting Warlock spell slots into spell point, and smoothing out the lumps of each new slot, it works out to:

Spell Points = Level + 1
Spell Cost = Spell Slot

So, for example, a Level 2 Warlock has 3 Spell Points. It costs 2 points to cast a Slot 2 spell, such as Misty Step.

These Spell Points refresh at each Short Rest.



This Short-Rest Spell Point system is so simple and intuitive − and balances so robustly even for the highest slots, like Slot 8 and Slot 9 − I hope it becomes the default for all spell casters.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I think it is likely that the pact boons will be like cleric's holy order, you get one at 2 and another at 9, maybe even a third one via epic boon at 20.

I could see that.

I could see some more boons, personally I would like a pact music instrument. I have doubts about it happening in the PHB, though.

Music as part of occult ritual is pretty widespread, so I could easily see it. My alt warlock has a “bell” ritual tool, with ritual tools replacing pact boons.

The arcane spell list (as opposed to the warlock spell list) reduces the value of invocations that let you cast spells. I think most of the "cast a spell using a spell slot" invocation will be to add 6th level or higher primal or divine spells to your list (you will get 1-5 from the patron lists). That leaves a lot of space for pact boon support invocations at lower levels.

I disagree. The warlock will have arcane spells except for 1 or more schools, and likely invocations that let you grab spells from those schools.

Given the "not useful in combat"/"too powerful out of combat" view that seems fairly common on the chainlock, I think there is potential for changing the chainlock by stealing the hexblade's minion. You get a combat minion that you can power up by disposing of an enemy (dedicating it to your patron; my design goal for the warlock is that your PC may be a good person, but he/she is still using BAD guy toys to do it).

I could see the chain familiar being boostable like that, but I am also certain it will still work with the existing non-phb invocations.

 

[mellored]

Probably won't happen but... Making pact magic (and Mystic Arcanum) invocations instead of a spell slot would fix number of multiclass issues, as well as add flexibility to the class. Increase the number of invocations according of course.

Probably will happen... Eldritch Blast (+agonizing blast) will likely a warlock feature, scaling by warlock level, not a cantrip.

So...

1: Eldritch Blast, Eldritch Invocations (including pact magic).
2: Pact Boon (chain, blade, tome)
3: Patrons

Chainlock gets a combat minion like the Battle Smith. Upgradable with invocations.

Blade should be armor and a melee Eldritch Blast (i.e. scaling by warlock level, not generic use Cha. Also benefits from invocations). If you have a magic weapon, you can add the effects on a hit.

Tome gets a bonus pact magic invocation, changeable after a long rest (short rest with an invocation).

 

[MechaTarrasque]

The warlock will be an arcane caster, but I suspect they will get some primal and divine spells from the patron as pact spells (unless they go with pact spells don't count toward your warlock spells known, in which case the lists will be pretty full without any other spell list; a body can dream...). I think you guys are reading too much into the bard and ranger and paying insufficient attention to the cleric when worrying about spell schools.

That being said for level 7 or above spells, I am not seeing any 5e spells that either aren't already arcane or that I don't expect to be arcane that would seem like good fits for the warlock, so I retract that suggestion.

 

[mellored]

More specifically...

Pact Magic: level 1 invocation
Select a arcane spell with a level equal to or less than half your warlock level (minimum 1). You can cast the spells without expending a spell slot at a spell level equal to half your warlock level (minimum 1). Once you cast either of these spells in this way, you can’t cast that spell in this way again until you finish a short or long rest. You can also cast the spells using spell slots you have of the appropriate level.
You can take this invocation multiple times, but must select a different spell each time.

And if there is any other particular non-arcane spell that should be warlock (Armor of Agathys), they can just be an invocation too.

 

[mellored]

Oh, also. Warlocks should do more curses. So make Hex a default, and then get patron specific hexes.

1: Eldritch Blast, Hex (+1d4 damage, -1d4 skill checks, cast again after the target dies or a short rest), Eldritch Invocation
2: Pact Boon (chain, blade, tome)
3: Patrons (Improved Hex).

I.e.
Archfey Hex. When you hit a target of your hex, you can teleport them 5'. Disadvantage on perception checks.
Infernal Hex. Increase the damage to 1d8 fire damage. Spontaneously combustion on death.
Celestial. An ally gains temporary hit points equal to your hex damage. Damage can be non lethal.
...

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Probably won't happen but... Making pact magic (and Mystic Arcanum) invocations instead of a spell slot would fix number of multiclass issues, as well as add flexibility to the class. Increase the number of invocations according of course.

Probably will happen... Eldritch Blast (+agonizing blast) will likely a warlock feature, scaling by warlock level, not a cantrip.

So...

1: Eldritch Blast, Eldritch Invocations (including pact magic).
2: Pact Boon (chain, blade, tome)
3: Patrons

Chainlock gets a combat minion like the Battle Smith. Upgradable with invocations.

Blade should be armor and a melee Eldritch Blast (i.e. scaling by warlock level, not generic use Cha. Also benefits from invocations). If you have a magic weapon, you can add the effects on a hit.

Tome gets a bonus pact magic invocation, changeable after a long rest (short rest with an invocation).

I don’t understand the idea of making pact magic an invocation rather than just keeping it how it is?

Oh, also. Warlocks should do more curses. So make Hex a default, and then get patron specific hexes.

1: Eldritch Blast, Hex (+1d4 damage, -1d4 skill checks, cast again after the target dies or a short rest), Eldritch Invocation
2: Pact Boon (chain, blade, tome)
3: Patrons (Improved Hex).

I.e.
Archfey Hex. When you hit a target of your hex, you can teleport them 5'. Disadvantage on perception checks.
Infernal Hex. Increase the damage to 1d8 fire damage. Spontaneously combustion on death.
Celestial. An ally gains temporary hit points equal to your hex damage. Damage can be non lethal.
...

Patron curses are unlikely, I think, because then all supplemental subclasses either suck or need errata. They could add invocations for it, though.

I have said before I think warlocks should get hex like rangers get hunters mark and then also a warlock’s curse feature that lets you do extra stuff whenever you curse a target, which includes hex, various other spells that describe themselves as a curse, Hexblades curse, etc.

I’d tie them to pact boon rather than patron, so if you have a tome, you get some super mage-y extra effect, Blade gets THP when the target takes damage, chain allows the familiar to deal extra damage to the target as well, and errata Talisman to allow you to heal an ally when a cursed target hits 0hp.