What are the strengths and weaknesses of different multiclass gishes?

[Blue]

14 is a viable attack stat for low levels.

longbow with 14 Dex = 1d8+2* 50% = 3.25
vs
firebolt with 18 Int = 1d10 * 60% = 3.3

Oh come on, I've seen your wonderful work in charop on Wizard's boards and here. You can't be saying that Firebolt is the expected damage of a weapon user. Yes, they are both "at-will", but weapon wielders at-will need to work out to be an average of spell slots used plus cantrips filling in.

Let's compare it to another weapon wielder.

Bards don't get longbows, they get simple and hand-xbow. So best single-attack is light crossbow w/ 14 dex. 1d8+2 * 50% = 3.25.

Anything else generic with 18 Dex: 1d8+4 * 60% = 5.1

And that's before fighting style, hunter's mark or various other methods of improving it, and definitely before extra attack.

I'm not saying bards can't gish, they definitely can. But you can't optimize away from another attack stat without impairing yourself prior to picking up shillelagh.

 

[mellored]

Let's compare it to another weapon wielder.

Bards are full casters. They don't get full at-will damage, with or without weapons. And 14 is still viable for low levels. My wizard killed plenty with 14 dex and his sling.

If you want more focus on damage, and less on spells, take EK or arcane trickster.

AT with green flame blade / booming blade works nice, since sneak attack stacks.
EK 7 and 10 are also very beneficial.

 

[Jessica]

How do Rogue/Caster based hybrids work out?

 

[Yunru]

EK/Sorcerer's a personal favourite. When you need a lot of damage fast, shoot 'em a few times followed (or preceeded) by a spell.

 

[Kithas]

Rather well, Rogue mixes well with Bard if going for ranged shooting(using magical secrets to get things like lightning arrow, divine favor/hex, and swift quiver) and very well with warlock for melee. Arcane tricksters mix rather well with wizards and EK's too. Ranger/rogue is also rather good.

I'm personally playing a fighter/Rogue/Ranger right now. I got a little greedy <.<'' It's been slow in the early levels but I'm definitely keeping up. And I'll have 4 attacks per turn, and 3d6 sneak attack by level 11(1/5/5), after that I'll get to 3(champion) in Fighter and then rogue after ending with 3/12/5.

 

[Zardnaar]

I like the fighter1/WarlockXYZ build. Nice and simple only needs 3 decent stats, pick up extra hit points via spells.

 

[Yunru]

"Only" should never be followed by "needs 3 decent stats". It's not a positive, that's the height of MADness.

 

[miburo99]

I wouldn't call it the height of MADness. I mean, most martial classes require at least 2 decent stats--Str/Dex, and Con. And several others require a decent tertiary stat (Int/Wis/Cha). A Fighter/Warlock isn't any more MAD then, say, a Paladin, EK, or Ranger.

Ftr 1/Warlock X is probably the most optimized way to play a Bladelock. Though with Shillelagh and Greenflame/Booming Blade, you can be less MAD with a Tomelock nowadays.

 

[Coyote81]

Ideally you want 1 stat plus con, two stat plus con is doable but you have to not take so many feats. 3 is just beyond realistic imo.

 

[krunchyfrogg]

Ideally you want 1 stat plus con, two stat plus con is doable but you have to not take so many feats. 3 is just beyond realistic imo.

Especially w/ point buy, which is how I roll.

I wanted to point out a few good Gish builds:

1) mountain dwarf abjuror. With point buy, you need a 14+ DEX (maybe medium armor mastery much later), a high CON and of course a high INT. The medium armor proficiency from race means you really don't need to multiclass.

2) deep gnome abjuror. The deep gnome feat will essentially allow unlimited hit points with an abjuror (non detection is an abjuration spell and can be cast at will). It isn't a bad idea to multiclass this guy if you want better weapons for a gish.

3) arcana cleric w/ magic initiate for shillelagh. Medium armor, SAD (WIS).

All three of these build should have green flame blade and/ or booming blade. As pointed out earlier, you don't need to have multiple attacks for a good gish anymore.