[White Wolf] Demon: the Fallen

[Gez]

The World of Darkness is becoming ever increasingly like D&D: you can't allow everything to exist at once, otherwise you end up with an inconsistent world.

If you already managed to plug Vampire, Werewolf, Mage, Wraith, and Changeling together (a feat in itself), adding sorcerers, mummies, hunters and demons will torn everything apart. And things only get even worse if you want to follow the rumors that Exalted is the prehistory of the WoD...

I'll wait to see and hear more about Demon, but I'm personnally not much interested in it. It don't seems too much compatible with the cosmology found in Werewolf, Mage and Changeling.

 

[Kamard]

blah blah blah blah blah words words words

That, my friends, is Demon: the Fallen

Sounds pretty cool, really. How well is it integrated into the World of Darkness, or is it?

 

[Bagpuss]

The World of Darkness is becoming ever increasingly like D&D: you can't allow everything to exist at once, otherwise you end up with an inconsistent world.

If you already managed to plug Vampire, Werewolf, Mage, Wraith, and Changeling together (a feat in itself), adding sorcerers, mummies, hunters and demons will torn everything apart. And things only get even worse if you want to follow the rumors that Exalted is the prehistory of the WoD...

I'll wait to see and hear more about Demon, but I'm personnally not much interested in it. It don't seems too much compatible with the cosmology found in Werewolf, Mage and Changeling.

Answer to that is not to run cross over games. Very easy to play a vampire game and never encounter werewolves, mages, changelings, wraiths, etc. Certainly when I run Vampire they only ever encounter werewolves as NPC enemies, and never encounter mages, changlings or the rest (well except Hunters, but only the V:tM versions not H:tR versions).

 

[SteelDraco]

How does Demon compare to In Nomine? I've really enjoyed everything I've read of that game, and have used ideas from it in my other campaigns several times. Anybody looked at both?

 

[Zappo]

The World of Darkness is becoming ever increasingly like D&D: you can't allow everything to exist at once, otherwise you end up with an inconsistent world.

Yeah, that's true. The official solution AFAIK is that crossovers are strongly discouraged. Yet, having a broad range of NPCs with very different goals and motivations is good.

Do you think that saying "Ok, in my Vampire campaign, mages, werewolves and whatnot exist but are extremely reduced in number when compared to vampires, they can only be NPCs, and they keep hidden from vampires just as much as vampires keep hidden from mortals" would suffice to hold the world consistant?

 

[John Smallberries]

Sounds interesting.

Any ideas on a d20 conversion?

 

[Zappo]

Any ideas on a d20 conversion?

The Storyteller system converts poorly to D20 and vice-versa. To do it properly, you'd have to remake it from scratch, and it's too much hassle for something you wouldn't be able to sell.

(IMO, that's because ST has a fine granularity right where D20 has a broad granularity (ST's XP versus D20's levels), and ST has a broad granularity right where D20 has a fine granularity (ST's 1-to-5 traits and 4-to-9 difficulties versus D20's 1+ stats and 5+ difficulties). As always in these cases, like when you convert between widely different sound formats without proper precautions, the result will likely incorporate most flaws of both systems and few of the merits)

 

[Gez]

Yeah, that's true. The official solution AFAIK is that crossovers are strongly discouraged. Yet, having a broad range of NPCs with very different goals and motivations is good.

Do you think that saying "Ok, in my Vampire campaign, mages, werewolves and whatnot exist but are extremely reduced in number when compared to vampires, they can only be NPCs, and they keep hidden from vampires just as much as vampires keep hidden from mortals" would suffice to hold the world consistant?

No. What I'm saying is that we need to say:
"In my Vampire campaign, mages, werewolves and whatnot don't exist. Except mummies and hunters, but you don't know it."
Or something like that.

 

[Tsyr]

No. What I'm saying is that we need to say:
"In my Vampire campaign, mages, werewolves and whatnot don't exist. Except mummies and hunters, but you don't know it."
Or something like that.

Except that in most of the "official" settings, they do, but it's like Zappo said... they are rare and not for PCs to be. I don't think we "need" to say anything of the kind.

 

[Mercule]

D:tF looked promising to me. Then I read the intro story they have posted on their website.

As a Christian, I don't mind a few allusions to the idea that God may not exist or be all he's cracked up to be, every character will have an opinion on the matter. What I don't like is "You remember God quite clearly. He was a sinister nut-job."

Talk about instant alienation.

If I'm wrong, great! I might pick up the game.

Oh, I also realize that non-Christian gamers probably don't have the same issue. I understand. I honestly hope the game is fun.