Is using a familiar in combat to grant advantage a common tactic?

lingual

Adventurer
How does a familiar find a dragon's weak spot? Not all dragons have a missing scale. Pointing out obvious weak spots like "the dragon eyes are not covered by scales" should not qualify as "help". Unless the encounter specifically points out a weak spot and also provides specifics on how to exploit it - then "help" should not work.
 

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jayoungr

Legend
Supporter
Familiars are too expendable now and lack much of the flavour they used to have. IMO.
They went the opposite route with the beastmaster ranger, and nobody wants to play it. I suspect fragile familiars that give penalties if they die would just result in PC wizards not taking the "find familiar" spell.
 

I reject the entire thesis that the rules are trying to "model an objective reality" (whatever that may be).
So you claim that you have no idea what an RPG is. That certainly explains your position.
I also reject the claim that Xanthar's Guide is an "obscure" splat book. It is pretty much 5e's only official splat book, and every D&D player I know uses it.
The subset of players that you know says nothing about the game as a whole. If you actually read the core rulebooks, then you'd know that the only content that exists within a game is the stuff that an individual DM has explicitly allowed at their table. Xanathar's Guide to Powergaming is exactly as canonical as any random PDF you buy off the internet, or any note that you scribble on a napkin - it's part of the game if the DM says it is, and it's otherwise entirely irrelevant.
 

ad_hoc

(they/them)
I find the concept ridiculous.

I also think by the rules it shouldn't be possible as the familiar can't attack so shouldn't be able to help attacks. I realize it has been clarified to work I just think it is dumb and would roll my eyes at anyone attempting it. It devalues other ways to get advantage and is hard to picture. Distracting the giant over and over again with a toad ruins the scene for me.
 

5ekyu

Hero
I find the concept ridiculous.

I also think by the rules it shouldn't be possible as the familiar can't attack so shouldn't be able to help attacks. I realize it has been clarified to work I just think it is dumb and would roll my eyes at anyone attempting it. It devalues other ways to get advantage and is hard to picture. Distracting the giant over and over again with a toad ruins the scene for me.
To me though, this is conflating teo different tules snd then deciding to say "no" because of the rules.

The help action in combat is *not* the same as "working together."

So choosing to see the limitations of one as applying yo the other is, to me, a stretch.

The help action in combat is just as achievable by distracting as it is by making an attack of your own. That's not just from rules as it is from practical sense. "You faint, distract the target or in some other way..." is clearly in both rules and normal language and common sense not requiring an attack to pull of helping the ally score a hit.

So, to me, I dont pull in the "could attempt alone" into the help action because even on the most basic rules level they specifically reference distracting and a familiar can absolutely be distracting... cue a thousand Don Rickles routines.

:)
 

They went the opposite route with the beastmaster ranger, and nobody wants to play it. I suspect fragile familiars that give penalties if they die would just result in PC wizards not taking the "find familiar" spell.

That was never the case. Most wizards had familiars. They were fragile and cost you xp but they had nice benefits and you never used them in combat. The problem with beast master is their beast is supposed to have combat utility while a familiar isn’t. Having a squishy pet that is designed for combat is suboptimal and that is why no one takes beastmaster. Having a squishy pet that has utility out of combat is useful (like a familiar)and worth taking.
 



So you claim that you have no idea what an RPG is. That certainly explains your position.
The subset of players that you know says nothing about the game as a whole. If you actually read the core rulebooks, then you'd know that the only content that exists within a game is the stuff that an individual DM has explicitly allowed at their table. Xanathar's Guide to Powergaming is exactly as canonical as any random PDF you buy off the internet, or any note that you scribble on a napkin - it's part of the game if the DM says it is, and it's otherwise entirely irrelevant.

I would like to see your source that claims RPGs are "trying to model an objective reality". Because everywhere I look the definition is something like this: "a game in which players take on the roles of imaginary characters who engage in adventures, typically in a particular fantasy setting overseen by a referee."

Now, it could be you are confusing "RPG" with "Science". You will find many who would consider science as "trying to model an objective reality", although it's not actually possible for science to prove that "objective reality" exists - that is taken as an act of faith.

And sure, its up to the DM to decide which rules to use and how to interpret them, so anyone who tries to say how someone else should apply the rules is, by definition, wrong. That applies to the equally PHB, which is no more or less canon than Xanthar's Guide, although in this case, both books are in agreement: "You feint, distract the target, or in some other way team up to make your ally's attack more effective." - PHB p 192. RAW there are no limits on exactly how the "help" action works, although the DM is obviously free to rule it any way they like.
 


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