H2 Thunderspire Labyrinth - I Have It!

[Grimstaff]

So does H2 have any meat grinder encounter like H1 does?

While I havn't read too far into the dungeon itself, it looks like (spoilers) players who act up in the trading area (pillar of seven halls) are in for a rough time from the resident wizards and their friends.

That said, a cursory glance makes me think anything involving gnolls is going to be tough too.

 

[carmachu]

Better or worse than H1 Keep of the Shadowfell?

 

[Shroomy]

Better or worse than H1 Keep of the Shadowfell?

Much, much better.

 

[Echoes]

Much, much better.

Just wanted to chime in and say that, after my Amazon package arrived this afternoon and I have read the adventure cover to cover, I absolutely agree.

Of course, I'll still need to work a bit at adding some roleplaying elements to portions of the module, but not nearly as much as I had to for Keep on the Shadowfell. Also, from a tactical standpoint, this adventure will be a lot more fun for a devious DM to run, since the encounters are well-designed (as opposed to the repeated "x minions, y skirmishers, and 1 brute") type encounters in KotS.

And to answer a previously-posed question, yes, there are definitely some rough encounters akin to the Irontooth one in Thunderspire Labyrinth, most notably [sblock] one with a duergar paladin, another with a green dragon and a number of nasty traps that begins with the party separated, and the final encounter, which pits just a nasty set-up of enemies (including two elites) against the PCs. [/sblock]

All in all, I'm much much happier with H2 than I was with H1. I hope the concluding heroic-tier adventure follows suit.

 

[Shroomy]

Echoes, what kind of role-playing encounters do you think are lacking in the adventure. My only complaint on that front (and it is kind of a minor one) is that none of the mini-BBEGs or the BBEG will really converse with the PCs. Still, I think that all of the role-playing encounters and little details more than compensate. Rich Baker does not disappoint.

 

[Echoes]

Echoes, what kind of role-playing encounters do you think are lacking in the adventure. My only complaint on that front (and it is kind of a minor one) is that none of the mini-BBEGs or the BBEG will really converse with the PCs. Still, I think that all of the role-playing encounters and little details more than compensate. Rich Baker does not disappoint.

What you brought up was a pet peeve of mine from KotS, and that it reoccurs in Thunderspire Labyrinth kind of irked me.

But I'm also talking about the fact that, though TL is less linear than KotS, it's still something of a point A -> point B -> point C adventure. I'd prefer that the plot is brought out more via some sort of roleplayed encounter rather than "at the end of A, the PCs find a letter written by the leader of B, and at the end of B, they find a scroll given to the leader of B by the leader of C."

I'm just going to try to spruce things up a little by interweaving the NPCs/plots a bit more. I've got a good hook already in that I made it such that my PCs in KotS are already trying to find several villagers from Winterhaven that were captured by kobolds/sold to the Bloodreavers, so they will ultimately end up with both the duergar and gnolls in TL, but now I'm rambling.

Anyway, I definitely agree that the plot and NPCs/details of TL are of a much higher quality than KotS. There are a lot of little flavorful bits that I am already turning into new plot twists...

 

[Lanefan]

What potentially worries me is a repeat of something in KotS: the maps supplied depict nice, large open areas for encounters. Exactly the kind of maps that are pretty easy to create on a whiteboard. They don't do any of the areas with narrow corridors, small rooms and restriction points: the very maps that are the most irritating to draw for the DM. C'mon, WotC, we don't need maps of the large open areas, we need for all those encounters in multiple rooms off of corridors, around corners and in labyrinths.

We-ell, from what I can tell 4e seems to want to specialize in big open-area set-piece encounters...which is good. There's one in KotS, for example, with some Goblins in a mine...some of the area is 10' below the rest, and the map shows where the ladders etc. are...and that'd be a headache to try and draw at all accurately on a chalkboard.

A couple of quick questions, for those as have seen H2:

1. The actual dungeon part - bigger, smaller, or about the same as KotS?

2. Can it be run independently of KotS, similar to how Forge of Fury could be run independently of Sunless citadel; or are they so much intertwined one pretty much has to follow the other?

3. Any good landscape or scenic art in it, such as was in Worlds and Monsters?

Lanefan

 

[D'karr]

We-ell, from what I can tell 4e seems to want to specialize in big open-area set-piece encounters...which is good. There's one in KotS, for example, with some Goblins in a mine...some of the area is 10' below the rest, and the map shows where the ladders etc. are...and that'd be a headache to try and draw at all accurately on a chalkboard.

A couple of quick questions, for those as have seen H2:

1. The actual dungeon part - bigger, smaller, or about the same as KotS?

It is bigger than H1.

2. Can it be run independently of KotS, similar to how Forge of Fury could be run independently of Sunless citadel; or are they so much intertwined one pretty much has to follow the other?

It can be run completely independently of H1. However, some of the initial plot hooks provided in the adventure relate directly to H1. The connections are tenuous at best and can easily be dropped for your preference.

3. Any good landscape or scenic art in it, such as was in Worlds and Monsters?

Lanefan

I have not seen Worlds and Monsters so I can't comment in comparison. However most of the art is practical. The adventure includes some art that can be shown to the players to enhance some specific encounters. The art is similar to that seen in Shattered Gates of Slaughtergard.

 

[EP]

Is the Labyrinth actually a labyrinth or just a big dungeon with lots of doors?

 

[Grimstaff]

Is the Labyrinth actually a labyrinth or just a big dungeon with lots of doors?

Its a 1-mile-square multi-level series of caverns, chambers, and passages. Kind of a cross between Descent to the Depths and Dwellers of the Forbidden City.