Making Minions

[greywulf]

Guys, unless I'm going completely blind, I can't find the rules for making Minions anywhere in the DMG. Or adapting them from existing Monsters, either. I've check both the sections on Customizing Monsters, and Creating Monsters, and I'm convinced it's got to be in there somewhere.

Now, I know Minions are basically like any other critter but with 1/4 the XP and only one 1hp, but where in the DMG (if anywhere) is the write-up to actually make them? Official rules are, y'know, nice to have sometimes.

I'm wondering because my Ninja Goblin Minions are waiting in the hallway, and they're getting tetchy.

 

[bobthehappyzombie]

Well, a daddy minion and a mummy minion that love each other very much...

 

[Mengu]

There are no rules for creating minions.

My way to create them is, take a skirmisher, soldier, or brute, drop hit points to 1 (no damage on miss), drop damage down to a fixed number as if all dice were 1's, remove all encounter and recharge powers, add a power that allows them to benefit from nearby allies or work better in mobs (possibly inspired by one of the encounter/recharge powers I removed).

 

[greywulf]

@bobthehappyzombie Lol! Oh, so thaaaaaaat's how it's done

@Mengu Quite so. I'm just surprised that.... uhhhh..... it's not in the rules.

 

[silentounce]

There are no rules for creating minions.

My way to create them is, take a skirmisher, soldier, or brute, drop hit points to 1 (no damage on miss), drop damage down to a fixed number as if all dice were 1's, remove all encounter and recharge powers, add a power that allows them to benefit from nearby allies or work better in mobs (possibly inspired by one of the encounter/recharge powers I removed).

Actually, it would probably be better to use average weapon damage instead of rolling a 1, otherwise the minions you create will be dealing less damage than the out of the box ones in published sources.

 

[Jhaelen]

Actually, it would probably be better to use average weapon damage instead of rolling a 1, otherwise the minions you create will be dealing less damage than the out of the box ones in published sources.

Are you sure about that? It seemed to be a better fit if you assumed minimal damage for the minions I checked.

 

[Mengu]

Here is a quick sampling:

Dire Rat min damage 3 (average 5.5), Giant Rat damage 3
Skeleton Soldier min damage 3 (average 6.5), Decrepit Skeleton damage 4
Zombie min damage 4 (average 9), Zombie rotter damage 5
Kruthik Adult min damage 4 (average 8.5), Kruthik Hatchling damage 4
Orc Raider min damage 4 (average 9.5), Orc Drudge damage 5
Orc Berserker min damage 6 (average 11.5), Orc Warrior damage 6
Sahuagin Raider min damage 6 (average 9.5), Sahuagin Guard damage 5
Troglodyte Mauler min damage 6 (average 9), Troglodyte Warrior damage 7
Grimlock Berserker min damage 7 (average 12.5), Grimlock Minion damage 7
Cyclops Rambler min damage 7 (average 12.5), Cyclops Guard damage 7
Cyclops Hewer min damage 8 (average 13.5), Cyclops Warrior damage 8

There are a few exceptions such as Goblin and Kobold minions, but most of the minions do damage closer to min damage, than average damage.

 

[silentounce]

Are you sure about that? It seemed to be a better fit if you assumed minimal damage for the minions I checked.

Hmmm... after looking at again it almost seems arbitrary. I was thrown off because I started my campaign at first level and my guys have only just made it to thirds, so most of the stuff in my head is low level monsters. Goblins, kobolds, and the like. It appears they have a higher damage outlay relative to level than higher level minions do. I wonder if they really had a method for this or they just eyeballed it. You'd think if they had a method they would have included it in the DMG with the other rules for creating monsters and the monster HP table. I guess it does loosely follow the table on page 185 of the DMG. It appears you are correct, 1 + whatever the number after the dice expression on the low end of the table. They don't give a minimum of 2 + the modifier for the high level minions that would roll 2 dice.

Heh, good thing I didn't create any new minions for my players to fight.

 

[Runestar]

I am inclined to believe that making minions is more of an art than a science. It would not be as straightforward as to simply give a monster 1 hp and divide the xp given by 4. Certain monsters may end up being too strong, others possibly too weak, since there are bound to be exceptions to the rule with any 1-size-fits-all template.

Anyone have any views on what pitfalls to avoid when making minions? Clearly, the more hp the base creature had to begin with, the more disadvantaged it may be (as may be the case with brutes, which tend to rely on higher hp to compensate for their slightly lower defenses/attack rolls). Lurkers, which tend to have less hp but deal slightly more damage/hit, might benefit from this change, conversely).

 

[ValhallaGH]

Watch out for fancy abilities that take rounds to kick in. Minions generally don't have more than three rounds of combat, and usually just one round when actually fighting. Giving them abilities that take more than that one round to kick off are a waste of text space.

Make sure minions have a mechanical reason to group up. Goblin Cutters get +1 damage for Combat Advantage, giving them reason to either flank or attack from concealment. Others get defensive or offensive bonuses for being near others of their kind. These are good abilities that emphasize the deadly nature of massed minions.

Any monster role can make a good minion, but most minons are Soldiers at heart. Start with monster role when designing your minons and keep it in mind when choosing their abilities. Minions are (usually) meant to be lines of troops that protect the back ranks for as long as they live, tying down the PCs with a real threat that takes time to clear up.

Artillery minions are just mean and cruel.