Adding Recharge to PC powers

[pukunui]

Hi all,

I am considering adding the monster power Recharge effect to PC powers. Essentially, what I propose to do is this:

As a non-action at the start of your turn, you may attempt to recharge any one spent encounter or daily power by rolling a d6. If you are attempting to recharge an encounter power, it recharges on a roll of or . If you are attempting to recharge a daily power, it recharges on a roll of . This is regardless of whether the power hit or miss when you used it first.

The Reliable keyword essentially means that the power automatically recharges on a miss. If you hit with a Reliable power, however, you can still attempt to recharge it as above.


Now, obviously, this is going to make PCs more powerful but I think it will make fights more interesting and less likely to devolve into hackfests where the PCs have spent all their interesting powers and are desparately trying to whittle away the big boss monster's massive hit points with only their at-wills (while the big monster's abilities recharge every so often, causing the PCs massive injuries in the process).

Allowing PCs the chance to recharge their encounters and dailies means that a) they might actually use them more often and for more interesting reasons and b) they might actually be able to end long slog fights quicker. I think it has the potential to be even more cinematic this way, and I don't see how they'd be able to "spam" better powers this way because they don't automatically recharge. They could spend an entire encounter trying to recharge a power and have it fail every time, whereas in a different encounter it could recharge every time.

Hey, if it works for the monsters, why not for the PCs too?

What do people think? Am I crazy? Are there consequences I haven't considered? Would you want to play with this rule? Thoughts please.


Cheers,
Jonny

p.s. I'm not really concerned with balance here. So far, I've found that 4e is inherently stacked against the PCs anyway, so in my mind, this would be putting the ball back in the PCs' court if not merely leveling the playing field.

 

[Stalker0]

If your not concerned with balance then go for it.

Just so you know this isn't a slight powerup. Its not a decent powerup. Its an incredibly awesome powerup.

If that's your cup of tea then go for it. But players recharging dailies so frequently, you will see a lot of awesomeness thrown around.

 

[Szatany]

Now, obviously, this is going to make PCs more powerful but I think it will make fights more interesting and less likely to devolve into hackfests where the PCs have spent all their interesting powers and are desparately trying to whittle away the big boss monster's massive hit points with only their at-wills (while the big monster's abilities recharge every so often, causing the PCs massive injuries in the process).

I'm currently working on a morale system which grants powers to players as a fight goes on. It also makes PCs more powerful and I have not yet come up with idea to even things out. Did you?

 

[pukunui]

If your not concerned with balance then go for it.

Just so you know this isn't a slight powerup. Its not a decent powerup. Its an incredibly awesome powerup.

If that's your cup of tea then go for it. But players recharging dailies so frequently, you will see a lot of awesomeness thrown around.

What can I say? I'm a powergamer, through and through. If I was a player, I'd love something like this. None of my players are powergamers though, so they might not like it.

I'm currently working on a morale system which grants powers to players as a fight goes on. It also makes PCs more powerful and I have not yet come up with idea to even things out. Did you?

Well, I think this does even things out. My experience so far has been that the odds are stacked against the PCs. Even low level monsters like goblins and kobolds have a lot of hit points and can high attack bonuses and high damage relative to the PCs. Plus monsters can recharge powers. Why not let the PCs? It's not like I'm turning all powers into at-wills. With encounter powers, they'll have a 1:3 chance of recharging, which is decent, but with dailies it's only a 1:6 chance. And they can only attempt to recharge one power at a time (one per round, in other words).

If it got to be too much, I'd consider introducing some sort of cost (maybe make it a minor action to attempt to recharge or make it cost an action point or build some sort of "recharge point" system).

 

[Szatany]

Tell me what you think:

http://www.enworld.org/forum/4e-fan-creations-house-rules/242547-morale.html

 

[77IM]

You could specify that the recharge roll only occurs when the character uses one of their at-will attack powers.

That way they can't be recharging one encounter power while using another, and a set of lucky recharge rolls can't have them spamming out the same encounter power for multiple rounds in a row. It rewards people for using their at-wills, giving them a tactical element ("Do I want to use my remaining encounter power, or use an at-will in the hopes of regaining my awesome encounter power?"). It might provide a nice ebb and flow to combat, where somebody low on encounter powers decides to use at-wills for a few rounds to build back up, and it could provide a nice consolation prize ("I only have at-wills left and I keep missing but at least I get these recharge rolls").

Note also that daily powers become encounter powers with this system, since the odds of not recharging your dailies during a short rest is incredibly low.

-- 77IM

 

[ff6shadow]

I think it would be fine for encounter powers, but recharging dailies is probably a bit much.

 

[pukunui]

Tell me what you think:

http://www.enworld.org/forum/4e-fan-creations-house-rules/242547-morale.html

I'll have a look when I get home tonight and let you know.

You could specify that the recharge roll only occurs when the character uses one of their at-will attack powers.

That way they can't be recharging one encounter power while using another, and a set of lucky recharge rolls can't have them spamming out the same encounter power for multiple rounds in a row. It rewards people for using their at-wills, giving them a tactical element ("Do I want to use my remaining encounter power, or use an at-will in the hopes of regaining my awesome encounter power?"). It might provide a nice ebb and flow to combat, where somebody low on encounter powers decides to use at-wills for a few rounds to build back up, and it could provide a nice consolation prize ("I only have at-wills left and I keep missing but at least I get these recharge rolls").

Note also that daily powers become encounter powers with this system, since the odds of not recharging your dailies during a short rest is incredibly low.

-- 77IM

Recharging only when they use an at-will is a good idea. Also, I wouldn't let them recharge anything outside of combat. For martial powers, the recharge represents getting lucky and being able to set up the move again. For magic powers, it represents divine favor or the fates aligning in such a way that your magic reforms and you can use it again or something.

I think it would be fine for encounter powers, but recharging dailies is probably a bit much.

That's why it's only recharge . I might also put in a restriction that you can't recharge the same power twice in a row. Or maybe with dailies you can only recharge them once a day (so they could potentially become "twice dailies" ... ha ha).

I'm sure there are all sorts of things I could slap on this to make it more balanced. I'm still waiting to see what my players think of the idea, though. They've already rejected some of my other attempts to tinker with the rules. Even though this gives them a massive power-up, they may not like it (they're not powergamers like I am).

 

[erf_beto]

I'd probably not make it a free action without costs, and would allow only encounter powers to be recharged.

Some other ideas I've considered myself (even using more than one at the same time):

• Recharge only once per round as a minor action (similar to what you proposed).
• Recharge as part of Second Wind (suits the flavor of SW, anyway).
• Recharge as part of Total Defense (so it's not just "do nothing")
• Recharge by spending Action Point (no die roll, just recharge any one power). This would overrule the "only 1 AP per encounter" clause, you can spend as many as you have.
• Recharge by spending Magic Item Daily Powers (no die roll). It's the weirdest trade-off, IMO, as it makes gear less interesting.
• Recharge by spending Healing Surge (no die roll). This might bring back the 15-min work day problem. And high Con paladin with the Durable feat = Energizer bunny for one encounter.

If you really want to recharge dailies, maybe you could do so on a short rest by spending Action Points (they'll basically become milestone powers then) or Healing Surges (though the day will be "shorter", I guess).

 

[pukunui]

• Recharge as part of Second Wind (suits the flavor of SW, anyway).

This is an interesting idea.

• Recharge by spending Action Point (no die roll, just recharge any one power). This would overrule the "only 1 AP per encounter" clause, you can spend as many as you have.

This one could work because I've thrown out the "milestone" thing anyway. Instead, the players can choose one of the following after every encounter: 1 action point, 1 healing surge, 1 extra activation of a magic item daily power (or activation of a ring's milestone power). So far they've only really chosen action points, and of course they end up with more than they can use by the time they take another extended rest, so this would give them something else to spend action points on.

I like the recharge roll concept, though, so I don't think I'd want it to be automatic. Spend an action point to get the chance to recharge a power rather than have it recharge automatically.

• Recharge by spending Magic Item Daily Powers (no die roll). It's the weirdest trade-off, IMO, as it makes gear less interesting.
• Recharge by spending Healing Surge (no die roll). This might bring back the 15-min work day problem. And high Con paladin with the Durable feat = Energizer bunny for one encounter.

Yeah, these don't really appeal to me either.

If you really want to recharge dailies, maybe you could do so on a short rest by spending Action Points (they'll basically become milestone powers then) or Healing Surges (though the day will be "shorter", I guess).

The thing I'm going for, and the reason I want to let them recharge dailies, is this: The PCs are up against the big bad dragon. They've spent all their awesome powers and the thing is barely bloodied. Meanwhile, it's dragon breath and tail slaps and whatever else keep wreaking havoc because, unlike the PCs, the dragon can't run out of cool things to do while the PCs end up just hacking at the thing with their at-wills in hopes that they will eventually kill it before it kills them. All of a sudden, though, the dragon leaves itself open and a PC is able to set up one of his more powerful attacks again (or the PC cleric/wizard manages to rejuvenate enough of his magical energy that he can cast a more powerful spell again) and BOOM! The dragon's in for a nasty surprise and will possibly end up dead sooner. How is that not cinematic? A lot of the time, the PCs will probably have used up their dailies by the time they get to the dragon anyway ...