Do you play more for the story or the combat?

[howandwhy99]

For the most part I agree. The story is in the process of being written.

D&D players are both author and audience each with their own section of the story to write.

DM is author in a sense that he or she provides the setting, the plot, the villains, and the non main characters. He also makes decisions for those villains and characters.

Players are authors in a sense that they provide the main characters, and the decisions those characters make.

Both DM and players are audience in the sense that the outcome of the decisions is largely out of their control. Just liek the reader doesn't know what's going to happen on the next page, we don't know what the die is going to roll.

To be true then the difference between narrative fiction and real life would not exist. We aren't authoring our own actions in real life as there is no storytelling going on. And in a game it is the same as real life. No storytelling. The only games where storytelling does occur are in those where people are telling narrative fictions. That can happen in a storytelling game. You may even use improvisational acting to tell a story. But you cannot tell a story a in roleplaying game. The role (or scripted character for theatre actors) exists separate from the roleplayer. You learn the role through roleplaying it. You are not creating it. Or authoring it in a storytelling sense.

IOW, you cannot explore a role that doesn't exist prior to your exploration of it. You can only explore something that exists separate from you and what you know. Think about the other way around. It is almost like trying to come up with a riddle to tell yourself. You would have to be some kind of amnesiac for it to work. First you make a riddle with an answer and then you, what? Search for an answer? It cannot be done.

EDIT:

Would you call improv theater not fiction and not a story?

It is assuredly not roleplaying. As I said earlier, I think this is our point of disagreement.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I'd hate to be the dictionary guy, but the biggest part of playing D&D is imagining things, and that is fiction.


This last one, in particular, dates back to the 1600s.

Fictional characters and settings form a part of fiction. Active play in a roleplaying game doesn't become fiction until the events have already happened.

A player playing a fictional character in an imaginary world and reacting to events as they unfold is not writing fiction. When the game is over the player may take the experiences of the character and create a work of fiction based on the events of that game session.

At this point the player can choose to tell a story from a 1st or 3rd person point of view. If the player started doing this during the session then he/she has stepped outside of roleplaying and into storytelling.

Can you see the difference?

 

[Scribble]

To be true then the difference between narrative fiction and real life would not exist. We aren't authoring our own actions in real life as there is no storytelling going on.

To an extent we are. hence things like "My time in office." or "The life and times of John famous guy..."

Most of our personal stories though are relatively boring. Ohhh one mans struggle to make sure his boss doesn't catch him slacking off...

And in a game it is the same as real life. No storytelling. The only games where storytelling does occur are in those where people are telling narrative fictions.

They're all narrative fictions some are just less descriptive then others.

That can happen in a storytelling game. You may even use improvisational acting to tell a story. But you cannot tell a story a in roleplaying game. The role (or scripted character for theatre actors) exists separate from the roleplayer. You learn the role through roleplaying it. You are not creating it. Or authoring it in a storytelling sense.

Yes, you create a character, and that character exists within the story you are telling.

My Elven Archer is a character. It exists within the story of my campaign, or just my adventure.

The Elves wish to survive. My archer wants his people to survive. The orcs attack. Conflict!

It's like an improv theater group. Each one has a character, each one must respond to what the other characters in the group bring to the story.

D&D has the added element of random chance as another "player" in the group.

IOW, you cannot explore a role that doesn't exist prior to your exploration of it. You can only explore something that exists separate from you and what you know.

A character.

 

[The Little Raven]

Active play in a roleplaying game doesn't become fiction until the events have already happened.

Active play in a roleplaying game requires use of your imagination. That is the act of imagining, which is a long-standing definition of fiction. Fiction is created and can then be expressed in different mediums, such as novels, comic books, radio dramas, films, interpretive dance, roleplaying game campaigns, and whatnot.

A player playing a fictional character in an imaginary world and reacting to events as they unfold is not writing fiction.

I agree that it's not writing fiction, because writing is an act in and of itself. It is the act of creating fiction, which doesn't have to exist in a physical form.

 

[howandwhy99]

To an extent we are. hence things like "My time in office." or "The life and times of John famous guy..."

Most of our personal stories though are relatively boring. Ohhh one mans struggle to make sure his boss doesn't catch him slacking off...

Based upon this and everything else in your post I think our conversation is over. In my world telling a story is different than living in the real world. In my mind it isn't hard to distinguish the two. Does anyone believe they are telling a story when playing Poker? Why do they when playing D&D or Monopoly or World of Warcraft? Because they are simulations? This is the confusion about what is "story".

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

This conversation is about as exciting as playing D&D for the story.

Wrap it up and vote already.

 

[justanobody]

You are of course entitled to define "RPG" however you wish, but most people use it for an entire genre of games, irrespective of someone's motivation for playing.

\/——See my signature.——\/

 

[Mallus]

This conversation is about as exciting as playing D&D for the story.

Hey... story-focused D&D is lot more exciting than this!

 

[Scribble]

Based upon this and everything else in your post I think our conversation is over. In my world telling a story is different than living in the real world. In my mind it isn't hard to distinguish the two.

In my mind it isn't either. The events of real life, can be told as a story.

You can even create a fictional story based on events in real life.

Does anyone believe they are telling a story when playing Poker? Why do they when playing D&D or Monopoly or World of Warcraft? Because they are simulations? This is the confusion about what is "story".

Because in D&D you create a character and goals that character tries to achieve. The DM creates an overall plot, and introduces conflicts to thwart your character's goals.

Thats what makes it a story. The narrative elements might not be important to you at all, but they are still there despite how little you describe them.

 

[Cadfan]

Honestly, D&D stories tend to be about as deep as professional wrestling stories.

That doesn't make them bad, and it doesn't make them unimportant.