Roles & Removing Power Sources

[Aldarc]

The advent of more formalized roles (defender, striker, controller, leader) in addition to explicit listings of a class's power source makes it far easier to adjust customized campaign lists of classes. The creation of more classes of different power sources that will fill different roles (as is speculated with the upcoming primal power source of the PHB2) also will make it easier to find substitutes for classes lost by removing power sources.

So have you removed, or do you have plans to do so, any classes of certain power sources?

I am toying around with a campaign world that removes the divine power source since the inhabitants do not really believe in gods, but instead venerate nature spirits, ancestral spirits, as well as powerful ascended Immortals. Furthermore, the people of the world do not really believe that ordination really gains supernatural powers, but that it comes from understanding the world around them. Ordination can be gained into a priesthood by any class through the proper feats.[D][/D]

 

[DracoSuave]

Fortunately, you can do that without more PHBII already... Paladin and Cleric being easily replaceable with Fighter/Swordmage and Warlord. This is a good thing, in my opinion, that you don't need to think of characters as 'such and such rogue, but such and such mage, so... we'll need to cover this mage angle here...'

 

[Aldarc]

Fortunately, you can do that without more PHBII already... Paladin and Cleric being easily replaceable with Fighter/Swordmage and Warlord. This is a good thing, in my opinion, that you don't need to think of characters as 'such and such rogue, but such and such mage, so... we'll need to cover this mage angle here...'

True, but as I said, it becomes much easier to do so when more classes from different power sources are added to the fold. Having the bard, shaman, and artificer classes in addition to the warlord make it much easier to set the cleric and the divine power source adrift.

 

[ForbidenMaster]

The advent of more formalized roles (defender, striker, controller, leader) in addition to explicit listings of a class's power source makes it far easier to adjust customized campaign lists of classes. The creation of more classes of different power sources that will fill different roles (as is speculated with the upcoming primal power source of the PHB2) also will make it easier to find substitutes for classes lost by removing power sources.

So have you removed, or do you have plans to do so, any classes of certain power sources?

I am toying around with a campaign world that removes the divine power source since the inhabitants do not really believe in gods, but instead venerate nature spirits, ancestral spirits, as well as powerful ascended Immortals. Furthermore, the people of the world do not really believe that ordination really gains supernatural powers, but that it comes from understanding the world around them. Ordination can be gained into a priesthood by any class through the proper feats.[D][/D]

Why remove the power source? Why not just change the fluf of the power source to the same fluf as your campaign?

 

[Aldarc]

Why remove the power source? Why not just change the fluf of the power source to the same fluf as your campaign?

Because I do not think that the divine power source is appropriate in the context of the created campaign setting. If you are asking this question then you are obviously not listening to what was being said in my original post.

 

[DracoSuave]

Right, but the 'Divine Power Source' is a changeable fluff detail. So if, for example, you figure that gods aren't a good source of power, but psychic power deriving from one's personality -are- then you can repurpose Divine to be closer to this new entity, changing the Channel Divinity repreqs to something more along the line of requiring a philosophy.

As an example, not saying this is approprate.

 

[Aldarc]

Right, but the 'Divine Power Source' is a changeable fluff detail. So if, for example, you figure that gods aren't a good source of power, but psychic power deriving from one's personality -are- then you can repurpose Divine to be closer to this new entity, changing the Channel Divinity repreqs to something more along the line of requiring a philosophy.

As an example, not saying this is approprate.

I hate having this mindset that I am somehow supposed to feel obligated to alter the fluff in order to keep the divine power source and associated classes. I thought that the separation of roles and power sources were supposed to allow for greater flexibility in class choices, but so far, this idea has twice been met with resistance. Why? Is the divine power source really that necessary for all D&D campaigns?

 

[DracoSuave]

Not at all. These are just options that are available as to further permit greater options. If you do not take them, that's fine. They are suggestions, not attacks on your premise.

That said, returning with an ad hominem 'Why are you so married to the idea of the crunch mechanics of the divine power source requiring gods?'

 

[Aldarc]

Not at all. These are just options that are available as to further permit greater options. If you do not take them, that's fine. They are suggestions, not attacks on your premise.

That said, returning with an ad hominem 'Why are you so married to the idea of the crunch mechanics of the divine power source requiring gods?'

I'm not married to the crunch mechanics of the divine power source requiring gods, as I do not use it in all of my campaigns. It just does not really fit the particular flavor of the campaign world as well as the envisioning of a priesthood or even philosophic principles. I do not even see clerics, paladins, or invokers (not sure about the avengers) calling upon ancestral spirits as a source of power.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

I'm confused.

First you argue that the new power source mechanics are supposed to make things more flexible. Then when someone suggests you "flex" by changing...

divine=powered by some diety
to
divine=some other definition that fits your game world

...which allows maximum flexibility for character creation you get huffy and attack them for suggesting something in a friendly manner.

What exactly are you looking for in this discussion?

DS