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New At-Will Power for Wizards - Staff Strike
- Thread starter Falling Icicle
- Start date
Nifft
Penguin Herder
Like others have said, the combination of Weapon + non-AC defense is problematic. Particularly Reflex, because Thunderwave targets Fortitude (which is often as high as AC, and would thus be less problematic).
Also, the push thing feels wrong because Thunderwave already does exactly that.
The main justification for a power like this that I could see is You Shall Not Pass, which could imply that you halt movement, or Immobilize, or Slow, (or even Push, but not necessarily). Any status effect would last only until the end of your next turn, of course.
Cheers, -- N
Also, the push thing feels wrong because Thunderwave already does exactly that.
The main justification for a power like this that I could see is You Shall Not Pass, which could imply that you halt movement, or Immobilize, or Slow, (or even Push, but not necessarily). Any status effect would last only until the end of your next turn, of course.
Cheers, -- N
JoeNotCharles
First Post
I see this is giving the Wizard a token melee power. I think it's fine for that, except it should definitely target AC and not Reflex.
I think its cool to give the wizard a token melee attack, but I think this one is too good.
Lets compare it to other attacks, assuming that reflex is typically 2 points behind AC.
A wizard with an 18 intelligence and 14 wisdom would be attacking at +6 v reflex with this power. That's the equivalent of +8 v AC. If he hits, he'd do 1d8+4 damage, and push the target 2.
In comparison, a Fighter with 18 strength, a longsword, a shield, and Tide of Iron would be attacking for +7 v AC. If he hits, he'd do 1d8+4 damage, and push the target 1. He'd have the option of shifting to follow.
That leaves the wizard as more accurate than the Fighter. He can push further, but he can't follow up, but of course as a wizard he's less likely to want to follow. His damage is identical.
I think this is problematic in an at will power that takes the wizard in a different direction from his regular abilities.
I think a better idea might be turning this into an encounter power. Boost it a little, make it per encounter, and instead of breaking the rules in terms of the wizard's shtick and infringing on the fighter's territory, it turns into a neat way to dabble and a nice "escape plan" attack for when the wizard gets engaged in melee.
Lets compare it to other attacks, assuming that reflex is typically 2 points behind AC.
A wizard with an 18 intelligence and 14 wisdom would be attacking at +6 v reflex with this power. That's the equivalent of +8 v AC. If he hits, he'd do 1d8+4 damage, and push the target 2.
In comparison, a Fighter with 18 strength, a longsword, a shield, and Tide of Iron would be attacking for +7 v AC. If he hits, he'd do 1d8+4 damage, and push the target 1. He'd have the option of shifting to follow.
That leaves the wizard as more accurate than the Fighter. He can push further, but he can't follow up, but of course as a wizard he's less likely to want to follow. His damage is identical.
I think this is problematic in an at will power that takes the wizard in a different direction from his regular abilities.
I think a better idea might be turning this into an encounter power. Boost it a little, make it per encounter, and instead of breaking the rules in terms of the wizard's shtick and infringing on the fighter's territory, it turns into a neat way to dabble and a nice "escape plan" attack for when the wizard gets engaged in melee.
Falling Icicle
Adventurer
It's also worth noting that staves are far from the best weapons out there. A staff does d8 damage, has a low +2 proficiency bonus, and requires 2 hands to wield, prohibiting a shield or off-hand weapon. It is an inferior weapon to the weapons a fighter can use. A fighter can use a longsword (which has the same damage, +3 proficiency bonus, and is only 1 handed) and still use a shield. With a feat, a bastard sword can be used, which is even better. Fighters get an additional +1 to hit with their chosen weapon category, putting them at +2 attack bonus over what a staff wielding wizard has.
JoeNotCharles
First Post
I don't think anybody's arguing against making it target AC. If it targetted AC instead of Reflex, then would it be balanced? That's a far more interesting question.
If it targeted AC, then... it would be good, but probably within the reasonable bounds of balance. It would be properly compared to druid powers that deal 1d8 damage and shift the target 1, and are usable on an OA. Shift is better than push, but push 2 is really nice. I lean towards thinking that push 2 is better than shift 1, because you can often shift into the optimum position to push in the direction of your choice, but I can see someone else disagreeing.
Falling Icicle
Adventurer
Okay, so let's say it targets AC. Should it be Intelligence vs. AC or Intelligence +2 vs. AC?
FireLance
Legend
I'd make it Intelligence vs. AC. Since a wizard's Intelligence should be on par with a fighter's Strength, this would give it a hit chance just slightly less than a typical fighter's at-will (because of the fighter's weapon talent, and the fighter may be using a weapon with a higher proficiency bonus).
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