RyvenCedrylle
First Post
Dual-wielding eladrin ranger/swordmage, here I come! Yeah, I know - it's cheese
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Arcane Power Excerpts: Feats
- Thread starter Shroomy
- Start date
twilsemail
First Post
I don't really think it's cheese at all. It's more than a bit MAD really. I might even change the adjective to "Flavorful." I'd pictured Eladrin ranger like this previously.
evilbob
Adventurer
Hopefully, otherwise paragon-tier Second Implement is worthless.
So, my biggest "WOW!"s:
Eladrin Sword - Holy crap. Do they realize that Cunning weapons exist? Hello uber-powered stunlock YIKES! Now eladrin are the undisputed kings of orb wizardry. No wait - I guess anyone can take Implement Proficiency (dagger) and pick one up... Gah!
Dual Implement Spellcaster - I'm guessing we'll start seeing a run on Mage parrying daggers in all the shops as sorcs especially start scooping them up! Anyone with Implement Proficiency (dagger) will grab the easy +1 AC, too. Overall, I'm wondering if this feat is an apology to 2nd-implement wizards who might have to pay a double-feat tax for Expertise?
Other coolness:
Arcane Reserves - neat, altho less useful at higher levels when you have tons of encounter powers and lots of ways to renew them.
Darkfire Implement - Drows get all the love.
Draconic Spellcaster - Made for sorcs, since Dragonborn are still pretty bad arcane anything else.
Enlarge Spell - For the cost of a feat you can ditch your War Mage staff - yay! Hopefully it's more than 1/day...
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Care to explain this one a little more?
TheWyrd
First Post
I still have my strong hopes of someday breaking out my poison mist breathing dragonborn feylock darn it all.
evilbob
Adventurer
Ok, let me see how this can shape up... You have your +6 Cunning Dagger in one hand, and +6 Staff of Ruin in your off-hand... You're doing 2x enhancement bonus of your staff extra damage (property of staff + Dual Implement Spellcaster), and with Spell Focus and an epic Phrenic Crown, all of your spells that target Will have a -2 -4 -3 = -9 to saves, without using any powers whatsoever. Or, swap your Staff for an Orb of Ultimate Imposition and 1/enc you can do -9 -(wisdom bonus) -6 to one creature, meaning with a 5 wisdom modifier you have -20 to saves 1/enc...
But honestly, we should probably not forget the Winter Sovereign epic destiny, which gives a -5 to all saves with cold powers, and the ability to make any daily into a cold power. Hello, -14 to save Legion's Hold! Might as well throw Enlarge Spell on that one too so you can be out of Orcus' aura's range when you stunlock him for all of time with a -25 to save.
But maybe this isn't how this works. We'll have to see what the text is; maybe you have a limited selection for your implements and you can't actually pick up a melee weapon as an implement. Oh, except: eladrin specifically can with Eladrin Sword, so... yeah. What are the rules on changing your race again?
But honestly, we should probably not forget the Winter Sovereign epic destiny, which gives a -5 to all saves with cold powers, and the ability to make any daily into a cold power. Hello, -14 to save Legion's Hold! Might as well throw Enlarge Spell on that one too so you can be out of Orcus' aura's range when you stunlock him for all of time with a -25 to save.
But maybe this isn't how this works. We'll have to see what the text is; maybe you have a limited selection for your implements and you can't actually pick up a melee weapon as an implement. Oh, except: eladrin specifically can with Eladrin Sword, so... yeah. What are the rules on changing your race again?
twilsemail
First Post
Disregard post, just repeating someone else's question.
ThirdWizard
First Post
I'm disheartened.
I see tons of Ability 13 requirements here. I hate Ability 13 requirements. But, I'm not going to rant about that at this time, just note it. Easy to house rule away, even if I think its bad design.
No, what really bugs me is all these feats say "any arcane class" in the prerequisites. Now, yes, its Arcane Power. But, you know what? These are some basic feats that would be good for non-arcane classes. So basic, in fact, for many of them, that I can't help but think that we'll be seeing copies of them in Divine Power and Primal Power, because there's nothing really "arcane" about them!
Take Nimble Spellcaster for instance. Why arcane? Sounds good for primal and divine as well. Why is a halfling wizard good at not provoking with area powers, but not the invoker or druid? They're all controllers full of area powers. Dual Implement Spellcaster is another one. A druid with a staff would be pretty cool. Do I have to wait for Primal Power's version to do that?
This preview is chock full of basic, non-arcane flavored, yet arcane specific feats. In my game, I'm just going to strip out the "any arcane class" prerequisite from them and go on my way like I did with the Ability 13 prerequisites for the like of Astral Fire (Dex/Charisma? Sorry Invokers!), but I can't fathom why they would take these perfectly good feats, and make sure that a wide variety of classes that they've put out who would love to have them won't be able to use them. Until their versions come out.
*sigh*
Okay, rant done. First 4e rant. Interesting.
I see tons of Ability 13 requirements here. I hate Ability 13 requirements. But, I'm not going to rant about that at this time, just note it. Easy to house rule away, even if I think its bad design.
No, what really bugs me is all these feats say "any arcane class" in the prerequisites. Now, yes, its Arcane Power. But, you know what? These are some basic feats that would be good for non-arcane classes. So basic, in fact, for many of them, that I can't help but think that we'll be seeing copies of them in Divine Power and Primal Power, because there's nothing really "arcane" about them!
Take Nimble Spellcaster for instance. Why arcane? Sounds good for primal and divine as well. Why is a halfling wizard good at not provoking with area powers, but not the invoker or druid? They're all controllers full of area powers. Dual Implement Spellcaster is another one. A druid with a staff would be pretty cool. Do I have to wait for Primal Power's version to do that?
This preview is chock full of basic, non-arcane flavored, yet arcane specific feats. In my game, I'm just going to strip out the "any arcane class" prerequisite from them and go on my way like I did with the Ability 13 prerequisites for the like of Astral Fire (Dex/Charisma? Sorry Invokers!), but I can't fathom why they would take these perfectly good feats, and make sure that a wide variety of classes that they've put out who would love to have them won't be able to use them. Until their versions come out.
*sigh*
Okay, rant done. First 4e rant. Interesting.
evilbob
Adventurer
Sorry, I'm going too fast - a bit excited.
Cunning Weapon: Any melee
Property: Against any effect delivered with this weapon that a save can end, the target takes a –2 penalty to saving throws.
Level 18 or 23: –3 penalty to saving throws.
Level 28: –4 penalty to saving throws.
So eladrin can take Eladrin Sword and grab a Cunning longsword and have up to -4 to saves ON TOP OF all other wizard save-related cheese. Just adding Spell Focus alone makes it a -6 to EVERY single save-ends power, all the time. That's pretty amazing.
twilsemail
First Post
Ok, let me see how this can shape up... You have your +6 Cunning Dagger in one hand, and +6 Staff of Ruin in your off-hand... You're doing 2x enhancement bonus of your staff extra damage (property of staff + Dual Implement Spellcaster), and with Spell Focus and an epic Phrenic Crown, all of your spells that target Will have a -2 -4 -3 = -9 to saves, without using any powers whatsoever. Or, swap your Staff for an Orb of Ultimate Imposition and 1/enc you can do -9 -(wisdom bonus) -6 to one creature, meaning with a 5 wisdom modifier you have -20 to saves 1/enc...
But honestly, we should probably not forget the Winter Sovereign epic destiny, which gives a -5 to all saves with cold powers, and the ability to make any daily into a cold power. Hello, -14 to save Legion's Hold! Might as well throw Enlarge Spell on that one too so you can be out of Orcus' aura's range when you stunlock him for all of time with a -25 to save.
But maybe this isn't how this works. We'll have to see what the text is; maybe you have a limited selection for your implements and you can't actually pick up a melee weapon as an implement. Oh, except: eladrin specifically can with Eladrin Sword, so... yeah. What are the rules on changing your race again?
In the end you're only casting through on implement or the other, Orb or cunning weapon. That should make at least some difference. I could be wrong.
Edit: I am, Orb doesn't require you to cast with that implement, sword does. Just cast with the sword.
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