The Power System, Combat, and the Rest of the Game

[LostSoul]

On what basis? That is the question, and 4E as a general rule and guiding philosophy offers an answer that has everything to do with an abstract game.

On the basis that the tougher/more powerful something is, it has a higher level. Just look at the MM.

A "bull rush" action would be more to the point -- but what difference does a shield make?

Whatever difference the DM wishes it to have.

 

[LostSoul]

Most of the design of the game as a whole is to the end of reducing the significance of choices. Again, my concern was with THE CHOICES IN 4E.

EDIT: Replacing the word "reducing" with "minimizing" or (better?) "limiting" may clarify.

It would clarify a lot more if you would support your point with some examples of what choices are limited or minimized.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Mmmm...I don't have a problem with PC's knowing the rules per se, but I will say this.

#1: It makes it harder for newbies. The easiest thing in the world to say to someone just starting off with D&D is: "Tell me what you want to do, and I'll translate it into mechanics." In that respect, "I trip him," becaomes something you imagine doing and want to do. In 3e, you could know the mechanics or not and it wouldn't matter. In 4e, you HAVE to know the mechanics.

#2: It puts an extra step in between Imagination and Result. You have to translate the effect into mechanics, and then back out of mechanics, to achieve what you imagine. In many ways, this ties what you imagine to what you can possibly have mechanics to accomplish. You don't think out of the box so much because the box is defined for you (as your powers).

Keen insights, I like where this thinking is taking me.

I don't disagree. I think the biggest change in the game experience I've noted is that where I would have used the rules to systematize the imagination I now use the imagination to rationalize the rules.

I've had this same experience with skill challenges as I mentioned in this thread.

 

[LostSoul]

I've had this same experience with skill challenges as I mentioned in this thread.

I don't see that problem in skill challenges because, I think, I make sure everything is grounded in the situation (the gameworld, the fiction, whatever you want to call it).

I think it's possible to play the game without referencing the gameworld at all. Still, I guess that's not different from from B/X onward. Even though 4E has a really good system for resolving any action, I think there is a "power fixation" syndrome.