Hackmaster

[Baumi]

I really like when your choice in Armor and Weapons are meaningfull but what I ment were tactics in combat itself (pushing back (as a maneuver), sidestep the enemy, knock him down, Feints, Intimitatation, Tricks, etc.).

I read several times that the heroes have to relly on tactics, wits, thinking, etc. so I thought there were a maneuversystem or some special moves in there.

 

[Greymarch2000]

I think that the tactics in HMB seem a lot more situational than d20 or 4E. In D&D 3/3.5 you'd tend to build a feat combo that you'd attempt to apply in every combat, maximing the power of your character build. In 4E it seems more of a question of when to use Encounter powers and wondering if you'll get to rest after so is it worth blowing a daily?

Those are all lots of tactical descions but I've always looked at combat in HM (and especially in Basic now from what I hear) as being more dramatic than tactical. Different combats are going to require different tactics, and a good crit or penetration can cause a huge problem, forcing players to think on their feet.

If the fighter gets knocked down from a good hit and creates an opening to the magic-user what should the cleric do? Heal the fighter? Block the enemies from getting to the wizards? While it is a tactical choice, the random range makes it more dramatic in my opinion than leveraging which power he should use.

That said there are some basic tactics like fighting defensivley or full attack which modify your ability to hit and be hit. Polearms behind a shieldwall is very viable in HMb. And from what I see most monsters fall from Trauma as opposed to losing all their hitpoint, so sending the Thief out to coup de grace them (which he can do in 3sec instead of 10) may be a good idea, but will he be exposed? Or will he pocket any treasure?

Also, I'd imagine a lot more things will be available in Advanced (like fighting with 2 weapons, etc..)

 

[theemrys]

Basic is still pretty basic.. but there are some tactical moves... (I've read it but not had time to play out a combat yet so actual play may vary some... )

Now, weapon choice during a combat can matter and isn't just on the "build" side, as you might switch party way through. Also, there is a "hold at bay" option where if you have a longer reach you can keep your opponent from getting withing striking range of you. They can attack the weapon to knock it aside and move in, but it does slow them down some. Very handy for a Mage who uses a quarterstaff (with a 7 or 8' reach IIRC).

Also, your defense die changes depending on how many opponents are there and where they are positioned... you only get your D20 for your front 3 opponents... and if someone gets behind you, you only get a D8 to defend... and you'd better hope it's not the thief.

What I also feel helps it seem a bit more "tactical" is that with the count-up initiative system, you can change your actions and "reset" your clock to react as things change... so if you're charging in and someone sets a spear, you can decide if you want to slow down... continue... try and change direction... if you're moving into attack and suddenly see a spell caster starting to cast, you can change direction to move for cover, etc. Also, doing actions to deter an intelligent opponent can also be useful. Nothing like having an archer draw his bow so that the enemy cower behind their sheilds for cover so that your battle axe wielding dwarf (who's not so fast on his feet) can get in a bit closer to the attack...

As others have mentioned though, there are a lot more options planned for AHM which I'm sure will spice it up even more (like detail crit tables).

 

[Thondor]

Illustrated combat example:

Kenzer & Company Discussion Forums

Hmmm, this link doesn't work for me. I even registered in their forums and it now says that I don't have enough 'priviledge'. Ah well.

I wonder if there are any interesting reviews up yet.

 

[theemrys]

Hmmm, this link doesn't work for me. I even registered in their forums and it now says that I don't have enough 'priviledge'. Ah well.

I wonder if there are any interesting reviews up yet.

Strange... still works for me....

 

[mhensley]

Hmmm, this link doesn't work for me. I even registered in their forums and it now says that I don't have enough 'priviledge'. Ah well.

I wonder if there are any interesting reviews up yet.

Try this link-

http://www.kenzerco.com/free_files/HMb/HMb_combat_example.pdf

 

[Nebulous]

Hmm. I don't know now after reading that combat example, it was really number crunchy. Lots of little things to remember, and i don't even want to think about how slow this will drag with a bunch of new players.

Having more special maneuvers would spice it up, but it will also be more to remember. I'll still definitely get the core book and roll up some characters.

 

[Nebulous]

And what's the best way to track the "count up" initiative? I didn't quite understand how and when people could attack, it seemed based on first contact and weapon length, and later on their speed.

 

[Mark Plemmons]

And what's the best way to track the "count up" initiative? I didn't quite understand how and when people could attack, it seemed based on first contact and weapon length, and later on their speed.

Initiative doesn't work much differently than in D&D and most other games where you have a 10-count round. You just don't stop at 10. A sheet of scratch paper tends to work for our GMs, at most. Players should just be able to add in their heads, since they're only keeping track of one character - or on scratch paper if necessary.

Once two combatants come into melee with each other, they can attack. Whoever has the best reach attacks first, then the other person can attack on the next second. After your first attack, you add your weapon speed to bring back your weapon and strike again.

So if you attack on second 4, and your speed is 8, you attack again on 12.

Or you can stop your attack in mid-stream (say on second 8) and start something else.

The combat example makes even more sense if you read the rules first.

 

[Nebulous]

The combat example makes even more sense if you read the rules first.

Yes, i imagine that would greatly help. What would happen if 4 goblins close on you at once, but you have reach against them?