Demon Queens Enclave - Session Reports

[Cadfan]

Still in the Pyramid of Shadows here (took a 3 month diversion over in Forgotten Realms). I think lots of groups started with H1 on release and to be fair it seems like people tend to level every month. I'd say a bunch of groups are coming to the end of Trollhaunt about... now.

Heh, we just did. We're about to enter P2 as well.

We dropped a character right at the end of H2, largely for the convenience of our players. We knew it had to happen, and rather than just have the character poof away into nothingness or get randomly killed, we plotted in advance that when the party got caught in the pyramid from H3, he would get stuck outside. Additionally, Splug got stuck inside the pyramid with the PCs (whole thing was Splug's fault, actually). He's a semi regular NPC now, having "won" infernal pact warlock powers in a bet that seems to have been less and less of a good idea as time goes by.

When we got out of the pyramid, we were dropped into P1, and had to solve it to get back to our original starting point, in pursuit of our long term goal of reuniting with our lost party member. When we did, we found that he had set himself up as the sheriff of the seven pillared hall, and after a short scene where we permanently displaced Brugg (and got him a new job as a city guard since one character is a softy), he gave us information that's acted as our hook into P2.

 

[Rechan]

Anyone got any brilliant ideas for Underdark locations?

My favorite is one that is mentioned in Worlds and Monsters - a Troglodyte "city" of giant mushrooms and other fungus that the trogs hollowed out, or sculpted to make bridges and things. The trogs even hide under layers of the mushroom 'stalks', to surround the party before the party sees them coming.

This could easily be turned into a "fort" instead of a city, but the same idea.

Another would be an underground "Oasis". Water spilling down into a pool, crystals creating light, plants and small harmless animals. The pool is guarded by a nereid or other powerful fey - possibly a portal into the Feywild's Underdark. Of course, she's powerful - trying to keep the Fomorians out.

Which might be another place to start - Fomorians, or other things living in the dark of the Feywild, that could peek their head out.

I had another idea for a fey (or some other) entity living in the Underdark. Called Sun Stealer - the entity has these crystals that emit actual Sunlight from the surface. Considering the things that shun the light down there (and possibly could just be damaged by sunlight), Sun Stealer is a neutral entity that bargains with sunlight.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

Next week I'm going to be starting Demon Queens Enclave with a small group in the UK. We'll have 5 PC's each week, although the number of players will vary somewhat. I am DMing.

I have a simple question - anyone played it? Any advice? Any pitfalls, or encounters that turned out to be way more difficult that you expected? Any memorable moments?

I'm hoping to tie in some previous player experience by referencing Winterhaven, the Mages of Saruun and so on. Plus making sure that character backgrounds tie in to the adventure.

Thanks in advance!

Edit: Since no-one has much in the way of advance knowledge, I'm going to be reporting on the game sessions as we go along with character builds, background info and battle reports, including anything interesting that comes out of paragon level play.

We played this from beginning to end. My advice would be:

1. Read book 1 carefully to memorize the motivations and political scene if you want to run that. You need to have it down pat. Don't be too disappointed if your players get sick of dealing with Drow and decide that genocide is more palatable than politics though(thats what happened to us).

2. This is skipping to the end, but the final battle is much more difficult than anything that comes before it. We were fairly optimized, and trounced the whole adventure before being TPKed in the final battle. I think the false sense of security over how easy it was killed us more than anything, but that fight was still damn tough. Its a big one, expect it to take at least 1 1/2 to 2 hrs.

3. Really memorize the town in the Shadowfell if you want to treat at as anything but a generic dungeon crawl.

4. Make your own treasure parcels. What the module gives is crap.

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

We played this from beginning to end. My advice would be:

1. Read book 1 carefully to memorize the motivations and political scene if you want to run that. You need to have it down pat. Don't be too disappointed if your players get sick of dealing with Drow and decide that genocide is more palatable than politics though(thats what happened to us).

2. This is skipping to the end, but the final battle is much more difficult than anything that comes before it. We were fairly optimized, and trounced the whole adventure before being TPKed in the final battle. I think the false sense of security over how easy it was killed us more than anything, but that fight was still damn tough. Its a big one, expect it to take at least 1 1/2 to 2 hrs.

3. Really memorize the town in the Shadowfell if you want to treat at as anything but a generic dungeon crawl.

4. Make your own treasure parcels. What the module gives is crap.

Thanks for the advice, that's really useful, particularly with regards to the treasure parcels. I'll have to make sure I put some stuff in.

We've had some changes around characters, and some added thoughts on background.

Human Mage - has taken the Prophecy background, and we've decided that all he knows of the prophecy is that it is prophesised that he "will meet Orcus". Given the content of the adventure, this is obviously very likely, but if anyone has any brilliant ideas about what the rest of the prophecy might say, I'd love to hear it.

The Avenger also has the Prophecy background - I can't remember off the top of my head what Deity he's gone with, so I'll have to do some work on that.

The Githyanki Swordmage is now a Drow Bard (bit of a change there!) I've talked about it with the player, and we think he's left the Drow settlement years before, as part of a long term plot to eliminate some of his House's enemies. The plan is he will 'befriend' some adventurers and bring them back to the City, and then use them callously to inflict damage on his rivals. Of course, when he arrives this is all going to go somewhat to pot. I just need to decide who's side he's supposed to be on - the (now) Undead or the surviving Drow? Interesting either way.

Player 4 is probably playing a Goliath Paladin, which should be... interesting.

In other happy news we have a potential 5th player! Haven't met him yet. He'll be coming along on Thursday and I'll hand him an Archer Ranger for the first session, and we can go from there, see how he likes it.

I'm going to remember that the big theme of this adventure/campaign is this: Who can you trust? I want to make sure the PC's are edgy and slightly unsure of each other all the way through, leading up to the finale.

 

[wayne62682]

I'm playing through this right now with my group; I don't know if it's my DM or the adventure but so far there's been very little interaction with anything, it's all been fights. The first encounter was a group of Drow led by a Drider fighting undead, and it ended up being a three-way fight, with one Drow surviving. After that it's just been one encounter after another, going from one area to the next. We did interact with a necromancer in a tower, and what I presume is a drow vampire during some weird dream-like sequence, and the drow matron who told us to go kill some other drow, but except for that there hasn't been any real interaction at all.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

We had the most amusing party ever for Demon Queen's Enclave, all built independently with no discussion:

Elf Ranger
Elf Fighter
Eladrin Warlord
Eladrin Warlock
Eladrin Wizard

Yes, you read it right, a bunch of elves to save the Drow from Orcus.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

I'm playing through this right now with my group; I don't know if it's my DM or the adventure but so far there's been very little interaction with anything, it's all been fights. The first encounter was a group of Drow led by a Drider fighting undead, and it ended up being a three-way fight, with one Drow surviving. After that it's just been one encounter after another, going from one area to the next. We did interact with a necromancer in a tower, and what I presume is a drow vampire during some weird dream-like sequence, and the drow matron who told us to go kill some other drow, but except for that there hasn't been any real interaction at all.

We went with as much interaction as possible, always talking before fighting. In the first encounter which was a 3-way fight, the party worked together with the Drow to defeat the undead. This continued for a while until the players got irritated with how evil the Drow were and decided it would be more satisfying to just kill everything in sight.

 

[CapnZapp]

We played this from beginning to end. My advice would be:

1. Read book 1 carefully to memorize the motivations and political scene if you want to run that. You need to have it down pat. Don't be too disappointed if your players get sick of dealing with Drow and decide that genocide is more palatable than politics though(thats what happened to us).

I haven't played this particular adventure, but what's up with WotC?

I have seen numerous adventures taking place in the Underdark and where the writer spent considerable effort on setting up different factions; possibilities for diplomacy and intrigue et cetera. City of the Spider Queen is one.

But then these involve hardcore ultra-evil factions like Drow or devils?!

What were they thinking?! What are they thinking now?

No, 4E Paladins won't autodestruct if they ally with Drow, but really, any D&D gamer worth his salt knows Drow will cheat and backstab surface dwellers every time.

It simply isn't interesting. Drow (and devils!) simply can't be used for a diplomatic adventure.

A real shame - these adventures could have been so much more interesting if they featured factions that you actually could consider talking to. No, I don't mean frightened halflings somehow trapped beneath the ground, but surely there must be some Underdark critter more trustworthy than frikkin Drow.

At least stop wasting effort writing up diplomatic possibilities and treat the Drow as the monsters to be slayed that everybody always treat them as anyway. If nothing else, it leaves room in the module for something useful...

 

[Cadfan]

No, 4E Paladins won't autodestruct if they ally with Drow, but really, any D&D gamer worth his salt knows Drow will cheat and backstab surface dwellers every time.

It simply isn't interesting. Drow (and devils!) simply can't be used for a diplomatic adventure.

Actually, in this one, working with the drow can be really worthwhile. I mean, yes, they backstab you, but things are set up so that working with the drow is much better than working against. Until they backstab you. Ideally you figure out that its coming.

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

I haven't played this particular adventure, but what's up with WotC?

I have seen numerous adventures taking place in the Underdark and where the writer spent considerable effort on setting up different factions; possibilities for diplomacy and intrigue et cetera. City of the Spider Queen is one.

But then these involve hardcore ultra-evil factions like Drow or devils?!

What were they thinking?! What are they thinking now?

No, 4E Paladins won't autodestruct if they ally with Drow, but really, any D&D gamer worth his salt knows Drow will cheat and backstab surface dwellers every time.

It simply isn't interesting. Drow (and devils!) simply can't be used for a diplomatic adventure.

A real shame - these adventures could have been so much more interesting if they featured factions that you actually could consider talking to. No, I don't mean frightened halflings somehow trapped beneath the ground, but surely there must be some Underdark critter more trustworthy than frikkin Drow.

At least stop wasting effort writing up diplomatic possibilities and treat the Drow as the monsters to be slayed that everybody always treat them as anyway. If nothing else, it leaves room in the module for something useful...

I disagree with you to the very core of my being.

Players may know this, characters may know this, but surely the point of the adventure is about where you draw the line? About whether or not you should save the Drow from the forces of Orcus, even though you know they're likely to backstab you?

And besides, not every gaming group is a bunch of ten-year veterans of D&D. Many groups are just starting out with 4e, and they've never had an adventure with Drow before. Would you avoid writing an adventure featuring Mind Flayers because "everyone knows all they want is your brains"? Or avoid writing one with Dragons as "everyone knows they'll just fly around and kill you with their breath weapon"?

Drow excel at diplomacy. The fun of the adventure is trying to make sure you can deal with them on your terms and when the ineveitable backstab comes, whether you can survive and make furious vengeance upon them.

I'm playing through this right now with my group; I don't know if it's my DM or the adventure but so far there's been very little interaction with anything, it's all been fights. The first encounter was a group of Drow led by a Drider fighting undead, and it ended up being a three-way fight, with one Drow surviving. After that it's just been one encounter after another, going from one area to the next. We did interact with a necromancer in a tower, and what I presume is a drow vampire during some weird dream-like sequence, and the drow matron who told us to go kill some other drow, but except for that there hasn't been any real interaction at all.

Ouch. Trust me, that's not how it's written. You might want to talk to your DM about other ways he can be handling the adventure before you get into the second part. There is a LOT of room for negotiation, deal-making and so on in this adventure and if they're not making use of it you're missing out, IMO.