Cons to break the Vow feats

[irdeggman]

Well you apparently allowed him to take all of those feats (which as has been posted can never be regained once "violated") - also you allowed him to break the RAW for Vow of Poverty since a cleric's holy symbol is not on the allowed items list - hence he should n't be able to cast most of his clerical spells.

FAQ

How do the equipment restrictions put on a character
by the Vow of Poverty feat affect class-defining items?
(Examples include a cleric’s holy symbol, a wizard’s
familiar, a samurai’s daisho, and a paladin’s mount.)

The Vow of Poverty feat is very specific about the items
that a character can own while gaining the benefits of the feat
(BE 48). It specifically disallows ownership of masterwork or
magic weapons, and thus a samurai who chooses this feat must
give up the possession of his daisho (his pair of masterwork
weapons). A holy symbol does not appear on the list of eligible
items, and thus a strict reading of the feat would disallow the
item.

A familiar, special mount, or animal companion isn’t a
material possession, and thus a character with Vow of Poverty
isn’t restricted from gaining the benefits of such creatures.
Remember that the Vow of Poverty feat, like most of the
material found in BE, is intended for mature campaigns that are
capable of handling difficult role-playing issues—it’s not
intended for most hack-and-slash games. A cleric who must
give up his holy symbol (effectively preventing him from
turning undead or casting any spell that requires a divine focus)
could be a very interesting challenge for a player who’s “done
it all” and wants to try something unusual.

Let's see ramifications of some of the vows-

Vow of Poverty - his "share" of treasure must go to a charity or outside organization (it can not be split among the remaining party members)

Vow of nonviolence - any party member within 120 ft of the PC who slays a foe suffers a -1 morale penalty on attack rolls for 1 hour/per level of the vow'd PC

While a great role-playing issue - the vows do have problems on other party members who aren't as into role-playing.

Do perfection bonuses stack? I am not sure on that one - you might want to see if it says that they do, otherwise a lot of those "bonuses" aren't near as high as you may be thinking.

 

[roguerouge]

Have you tried using swarms? Those automatically hit. So do mobs, from DMGII, and your party may be high enough level to start using them. You could use sentient constructs, as they're immune to nonlethal damage. (What's good for the goose, is good for the gander.)

Grapplers, too, would do wonders against this fellow... who doesn't have still spell or improved grapple.

 

[Starbuck_II]

Well you apparently allowed him to take all of those feats (which as has been posted can never be regained once "violated") - also you allowed him to break the RAW for Vow of Poverty since a cleric's holy symbol is not on the allowed items list - hence he should n't be able to cast most of his clerical spells.

True, he'd be stuck casting cure spells (what other spells don't require holy symbol besides cure spells?)
And he is allowed to holde stuff, but he can't keep it/use.
If he couldn't hold it: he'd be unable to take his share of the wealth silly.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Yeah, on that note...not allowing relatively cheap items, like a 1 gp wooden holy symbol, that certain classes require to function, is pretty adversarial and unnecessarily harsh. a wizard's spellbook, with the massive ink costs...yeah, sadly that just can't be allowed. A simple holy symbol though? Just because the text wasn't well written doesn't mean you should blindly follow it. I'm still wondering why a heavy crossbow is considered ok, but not a silver or cold iron dagger (to fight devils and demons, both costing far less than the xbow which is legal). So...I allowed VoP characters to carry one silver and one cold iron weapon...

 

[Dandu]

Yeah, on that note...not allowing relatively cheap items, like a 1 gp wooden holy symbol, that certain classes require to function, is pretty adversarial and unnecessarily harsh.

If you can't take the heat, don't take the feat.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

If you can't take the heat, don't take the feat.

Yup, I'm now convinced VoP is exactly like the Paladin. Accept stiff "roleplaying" penalties and the fact that your DM can at any time revoke it all on a whim because it's-just-that-easy! in return for the "tremendous power" compared to other classes or feats. Cause VoP is totally more powerful than Leadership, just as Paladin completely pwns wizard. *eyeroll*

 

[Dandu]

Was there a point somewhere in that post?

 

[Starbuck_II]

Was there a point somewhere in that post?

Arguing that Wizards have less restrctions, but are more powerful than Pallys.

Same thing with VoP is less powerful over all (you can get more benefit out of right items) than get by the feat.

 

[Dandu]

What does that have to do with the OP's request? I believe the topic was how to get someone to fall. The last relevant post was one pointing out that the cleric's holy symbol would do, unless it was tattooed into his flesh.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

My point was the whole topic makes me sad. I'll stop jacking, then, so people can go back to helping the OP find ways to permanenetly revoke his player's subpar feat choices.